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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

I spotted a preferred pronouns badge in the wild

145 replies

EoinMcLovesCakeJumper · 18/11/2019 17:54

I was in a shop today when I noticed that the person behind the till was wearing a big badge in the trans flag colours with the words "They Them" on it. It's the first time I've seen one of these and it just set me to wondering what the point of them actually is.

If I'm participating in a retail transaction with a shop assistant, I'm not going to be using their third person pronouns. At most, I might say "you", as in "Could you put it in a bag, please?", but surely I'd only say "he/she/they" if I was talking about that person to someone else? Perhaps I've missed something, but it seems like a way of drawing attention to one's special status in a situation where people might otherwise not notice.

And anyway, if I hadn't spent so much time reading about this stuff on MN, I would probably have assumed that They Them was the name of some band that I hadn't heard of. There was The The back in the day, after all...

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Akire · 19/11/2019 08:23

For example I’m 1/3 on way to MN ban because on reporting on a radio conversation by a trans person. Who sounded 100% of one sex but who identified as another. Radio given no more visual clues just a voice. I accidentally typed the wrong pronoun.

I didnt swear or act aggressively (I’ve been called far worse on those boards myself and screamed at, without anyone finding that unacceptable) be mean or threaten or say anything racist or otherwise phobic. But it was suffice to a crime to be on way to ban forever. It’s not that people are “just being asked nicely” to try and remember someone’s changed how they feel, it’s potential if you get it wrong to end up in all sorts of trouble.

No wonder people feel forced at gunpoint into accepting these baffling changes and want point the over whelming unfairness if you get it wrong.

TheProdigalKittensReturn · 19/11/2019 08:07

Neither "he" nor "she" are slurs with centuries of racism and an international trade in human beings behind them.

BowermansNose · 19/11/2019 08:03

Dictating how others speak about you to other people is facist nonsense

”Absolutely, I was talking to a colleague the other day, and I called another colleague a N***. Someone overheard me and now I lost my job. Bloody fascists.”

Ok, I think the pronoun thing is ridiculous, but we do make judgements on how people talk about other people and it isn’t fascist to do so

TheProdigalKittensReturn · 19/11/2019 07:40

Go find a member of staff who's less likely to shout at you?

joystir59 · 19/11/2019 07:35

I don't understand what a badge stating "they, them" is asking me to do. Can someone please explain

Stegosaurus1990 · 19/11/2019 07:33

Maybe they have really crap customer service and they want to make it harder to identify them from their colleagues.

littlbrowndog · 19/11/2019 07:33

Kittens 😂

TheProdigalKittensReturn · 19/11/2019 07:32

Prisoner, not prison. There are no trans prisons, although that's not a bad idea, it would certainly make more sense than putting transwomen in with female prisoners.

TheProdigalKittensReturn · 19/11/2019 07:30

There was a trans prison in Scotland who wanted prison staff to call them Mighty Almighty (can't remember the actual name because really, which is more memorable?).

Refusing to call someone Mighty Almighty when they are in prison for doing Very Bad Thing - impolite?

motorcyclenumptiness · 19/11/2019 07:30

I like it when people indicate their preferred pronouns. It makes it easier to recognise when the conditioning to which I've been subject since birth because of my biology is being played and I'm being gaslighted.

TheProdigalKittensReturn · 19/11/2019 07:29

OT but I'm so, so glad to have littlbrowndog back...

NotBadConsidering · 19/11/2019 07:27

But the only way third person pronouns matter in terms of politeness is if the person in question isn’t there and you want to be polite about them when discussing them with others. This only matters if you’re worried those others would dob you in, or think you’re an evil T*rf for not complying. Given I don’t care any more about being dobbed in or whether people think I’m transphobic, due to the vagaries of that term, I now refuse to be compelled to talk about someone how they want if that’s not how I view them.

It’s like Donald Trump saying everyone must call him The Greatest President Ever and thinking we will all do it, particularly if he’s wearing a badge saying the same.

littlbrowndog · 19/11/2019 07:13

Do you find it hard to be polite broomstick ?

BroomstickOfLove · 19/11/2019 06:59

I like it when people indicate their preferred pronouns. It makes it easier to be polite.

DuMondeB · 19/11/2019 05:20

I can’t imagine I will ever be in a position where I have to state my pronouns but if I do I will be channelling Titania McGrath and going for she/ra

NotBadConsidering · 19/11/2019 02:26

The badge is actually saying:

“When you talk about me when I’m not present, I insist you refer to me in a certain way”.

I will not be dictated to as to how I will discuss people who aren’t even around.

TheProdigalKittensReturn · 19/11/2019 01:08

I'd react exactly the same way I would to a badge reading "Ask me about Jesus" - nope, no thank you, I am not interested in being evangelized at.

ErrolTheDragon · 19/11/2019 01:06

Maybe it's the most interesting thing about them?Confused

aliasundercover · 19/11/2019 00:47

ask me about my pronouns

OK. Why the fuck do you need special pronouns?

Butterisbest · 19/11/2019 00:17

I've always wondered about Maria with the swearing on the bible in Court I swear by Almighty God that the evidence I shall give shall be the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth
Then she was forced to lie about the correct sex of her assailant and her compensation was reduced because she inadvertently used her assailant's correct sex.
So where the fuck is being kind there? A woman was beaten around the head by a male person that identified as female and the victim was ordered to lie in court. Under Oath.
Again what's fucking kind about that. Not very much.

TheProdigalKittensReturn · 19/11/2019 00:15

Luis and Yuki speaking for all of us there.

OldCrone · 19/11/2019 00:07
OldCrone · 19/11/2019 00:06

It's just that many of the comments are simply mocking people wanting to have a preferred pronoun, not discussing the change.

Why is it so important for some people to control the speech of others when they're not there?

JellySlice · 18/11/2019 23:53

Yeah, He-Man needed to announce his pronouns, because that gender non-conforming hairstyle really confused everyone.

terfsandwich · 18/11/2019 23:28

It makes me think Maria MacLachlan should have asked for a woke translator to avoid "contempt in court". She could have been able to speak her truth then the court could have translated it into 2×2=5.