Marks and Spencer have fallen, part III; we’re gonna need a bigger boat

It's quite incredible coatandhat . Not only have M & S pissed off the majority of their women customer base but they have put their female staff into an impossible and at times, dangerous and degrading position. Yet they don't give a fuck?! Can it really be that all that matters to them are the rainbow glitter awards from dodgy charities?
This really isn't the business that I and my family have supported for decades.

@DurtySarf - Do go and speak to them! I actually felt a bit nervous beforehand and like I was going to fraternise with the enemy but the staff were really nice and once we were talking, it all just flowed They need to know that we are not going to just take it lying down.

There's an M&S right next to my work and every day for the past fortnight I have walked past it to get my lunch elsewhere. I'm saving loads of money and finding all sorts of nice places.

But having read @Coatandhat I'm wondering if I should go in and talk to staff instead.

Good to have those conversations though Coatandhat. It might initiate discussions amongst the staff.

What's interesting is that, clearly, the shop floor staff are either uninformed of this policy or very unhappy with it. So M&S are not only ignoring their customers, they are shitting all over the very staff they have tasked with implementing this crap.

Which, as far as I'm concerned, is double the reason to avoid the nasty bastards.

Thanks for that Coatandhat. Really interesting but depressing.

I went into my local M&S this afternoon to speak to someone on the lingerie fitting room about their policy. When I arrived there was no one at the desk but I could hear the assistant was helping a customer with a bra fitting. When she finally came out, I asked her whether men were allowed in there because I'd read online that this is their policy now. She said that if a man approached that changing room, he would be redirected to the one by the men's department. I pointed out that this was different to the official policy and that there wasn't always a member of staff in attendance, like today and that a man could be in the fitting room already before I arrived. She agreed and said it was a grey area and that you have to be careful what you say ( I think she meant about sexual politics and not M&S policy). I sympathised that it was down to staff like her to decide how to deal with a man dressed in women's clothes.

She asked if I would like to speak to the store manager (a woman) who turned out to be unavailable. However, the manager of the departments upstairs (a woman in her 20's) came along, shortly followed by her manager (a woman in her 40's). To begin with they trotted out the party line that as a retailer they had come under pressure to keep up with the changing times and that they were one of the last to do so. I pointed out following the example of others didn't make it right and that it was possible to be inclusive by offering a third changing facility for those not comfortable in the Men's or Women's without alienating their core customer base. Then they gave a different version of the policy - if a man wanted to use the changing room and there were women already in there, they would ask the women if they minded a man coming in. If there was no one in there already, a man could just go in. I asked how I would know if there was a man in there if I arrived after him and they said I should ask a member of staff to find out for me!

They said that there had't been any incidents to date because they would know about them for sure but I said it wasn't good enough for M&S to act after the event. I told them that DD had already been a victim of voyeurism in another store's mixed changing room (which wasn't labelled as such) with locking cubicle doors and high partition walls like theirs and they were horrified. I stressed that I was uncomfortable undressing in an area where they might be men and that I wouldn't be spending any money with M&S unless the policy was changed. The younger woman said she was sorry and that she wanted me to have the best shopping experience. We discussed it for over 20 minutes and gradually they admitted that they had their own views on it but that they were unable to speak out against company policy. The more senior Manager said she would pass on my comments but even she wasn't sure whether they would go beyond the Store Manager. They were also unimpressed that the concerns in my emails to HQ hadn't been properly addressed. They recommended contacting Customer Services by phone and asking to speak to the highest person and to just keep up the pressure.

I was in a retail park today picking up sports stuff for child normally I would have mooched round M&S and probably picked up an new top or something for work and spend £50 in the food hall.

Not today. Not ever again.

Meanwhile some poor soul will be trying to manoeuvre a moob into
a g cup and trying to ignore the other chubby thing pressing into her leg
That's gross, and obviously true which makes it grosser if that's even a word.
Feel for the women who have to do this shit to keep jobs.
I suspect everything will be bought online soon. And my blacklight is on order, everything I buy is going to be tested and sent straight back before I even try it on if necessary.

TheABC I buy bras from here, as suggested by another mumsnetter to whom I am eternally grateful. www.ewa-michalak.pl/eng_m_BRAS_BM-Bras-220.html
I am a 28 back in UK bras, around a GG/H cup. I wear a 30GG in Ewa as the back is small enough, (a 28 is made but by special order so not returnable) and fits like a UK 28.
These are a much more flattering shape on me the Freya etc.

I am bloody annoyed about Bravissimo as I actually need new bras and it's hard to find ones for my shape (small back and large front).

Aye Mark’s Suspenders. I wonder how good your appropriate action will be...

Appropriate my arse.

And the appropriate action was to let him walk free.

Uncompromising
That deserves a thread all of it’s own! Could also help to peak self Id another set of mumsnetters. How disgusting that he is free....

Having once had a senior who did that kind of thing with alarming regularity, I can only agree.

Oh for the auld gobshite that I am now to meet with him back in the day. Sadly I was 19 and a mouse.

It is gross and I’m sorry. But it happens and will happen in those changing rooms. Again by men who are old enough to know better, act better, BE better and who will wave the senior/persecuted/discriminated cards with gay abandon when challenged.

The ones who want to feel like women? They need to feel how it is to walk in our shoes, having their right stolen and then hook their bellies up into a bra and say it feels good.

Raging and sad.

Here you are - here's another chap those still shopping in M & S can enjoy sharing the changing rooms with:

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7714375/Decorated-GCHQ-employee-39-released-spending-terrible-night-jail-filming-women.html?ns_mchannel=rss&ico=taboola_feed_desktop_news

@NumbersStation - so true but so gross.

The staff don’t matter. As long as the mansuits can pat eachother on their woke little backs.

Meanwhile some poor soul will be trying to manoeuvre a moob into a g cup and trying to ignore the other chubby thing pressing into her leg

Bravissimo can fuck off. I mean their whole target market is women with large cup sizes. I feel for the staff in these cases, forced to fit bras on blokes because “feelings”.
Also the obfuscation....trans identifying female people in Bravissimo, fine with me obvs. Non binary people ? What does that mean Bravissimo ? Females who wear trousers and have short hair ? Eg most women ? Or men with beards who want to trample all over women for kicks ?
When will people wake up and see this whole agenda relies entirely on sexism.

I’m still boycotting. 😡

Go woke. Go broke.

Does anyone know if this is happening in other European countries, or is it just here?

@SirVixofVixHall

You're quite right. Several people, including @Jeanhatchet, have dug all the way down in the manifesto. sex = gender. Self ID. FFS.

Got bad news ladies. Bravissimo has gone woke.

meaww.com/amp/lingerie-retailer-bravissimo-allow-people-identify-transgender-try-products-changing-rooms

Labour have said they will bring in self id, and that transwomen are women, so their idea of single sex space is not single sex.

I suspect that won't happen until the anti-woman charity that peddles all the misinformation about the equality act is held to account for their lies - or until the secret filming and perving on women reaches even worse levels than it already is.
Although, having looked at the amount of money that we spend at M & S - especially at Christmas - the boycott just might have an impact?