Marks and Spencer have fallen, part III; we’re gonna need a bigger boat

Most women don’t know about the changing rooms so m&s may yet succeed. My mother really doesn’t get why I’m boycotting them at all. She fully comprehends she could be changing next to a male and is definitely gender critical. I think it is possibly because she’s never been in such sticky situations as me. In any case, I despair.

@numberstation. Pffnarrf

Bid to revive its flagging fashion arm?

There will be plenty of unflagging arms reviving something after a fashion in the changing rooms...

Loving Briz on the comments, raising awareness as some readers clearly not aware of the change in policy.

Some great comments on that article.

No, M&S, this story isn't going to slip quietly away (see comments)

www.thetimes.co.uk/article/marks-spencer-poaches-tesco-boss-in-bid-to-revive-its-flagging-fashion-arm-mv6w95lst?shareToken=896b476c645b53542d9c2a1972e65391

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6796451/Surrey-father-two-jailed-posting-46-upskirt-videos-London-Underground-adult-website.html

There are many websites but one that apparently specialises in secretly filmed women - voyeurstyle.com. It's gross. Warning you.

www.nbcphiladelphia.com/news/local/Chester-County-Man-Target-Stores-Montgomery-County-Holes-Drilling-Child-Pornography-Charges-511088221.html

www.chroniclelive.co.uk/news/north-east-news/cctv-released-after-man-exposed-14449259

Having a debate with someone - any chance anyone has examples of abuse, hidden cameras etc in UK changing rooms recently?

I know about the 46 year old changing the women's toilet sign the other day...

I need specific changing rooms, ideally retailers and not gyms...

One the one hand, men have more money. On the other hand, if one man buys 100 pairs of knickers and 1000 women buy one pair each you're better off with the latter. So the question is how many male knicker buyer there are (and if they all plan to build extensions for their lingerie purchases).

I'm picturing something like a hoarder's house, but with painfully tacky scanties that probably don't fit the owner anyway.

Do we know who has been putting pressure on M&S to go mixed-sex?

Wokesters deciding sales of their Autograph range are so low they’ve rebranded as the Autogynephile range.
Or maybe they believe every £10 spent by males magically transforms into £100 so they don’t want women to shop there anymore.

In terms of national chains of that sort surely Ann Summers was sufficient.

(Has never been in one of their shops)

Just reported a Mark's Suspenders Facebook ad as sexually inappropriate. Hadn't seen that category before; I will be making full use of it. Seeing as they have basically relaunched themselves as a fetish shop.

I'm sure you're right SirVix Do we know who has been putting pressure on M&S to go mixed-sex? Have they presented it as an attractive cost-free way to become "inclusive"? Given that the M&S policy is to be reactive - "if any customer was to act inappropriately, the necessary action would be taken" - it would be interesting to know how many people and of which sex have complained that they have been made to feel uncomfortable in M&S changing rooms.

I really do not believe that males of any identity care much about sharing space with other males. Transactivists will after all be sharing with plenty of other males if all spaces become mixed sex. The aim is not to gain a female identified space, but for women to lose it. Otherwise they would be campaigning for a mixed sex space along with the women’s and men’s, as mixed sex is what they will get anyway.

Sorry if this has been covered but I note Bravissimo has fallen.

www.thesun.co.uk/news/10388647/lingerie-chain-bravissimo-now-allows-people-who-identify-as-transgender-to-try-on-bras-in-the-changing-rooms/

Ffs

There is going to be nowhere left to shop.

That's really interesting to read about your experience Coat I feel quite positive that this policy will be overturned eventually so we should definitely keep up the pressure, it's just what could possibly happen in the meantime and of course by then it would be too late.

Michelle your last two paragraphs sum it up very articulately.

I'm genuinely shocked with Bravissimo. I've spent quite a lot of money with them over the years but they can fuck off too now.

I'm literally terrified for my young granddaughters. Female spaces will be long gone by the time they are adults.

@YourOpinionIsNoted

What's interesting is that, clearly, the shop floor staff are either uninformed of this policy or very unhappy with it. So M&S are not only ignoring their customers, they are shitting all over the very staff they have tasked with implementing this crap.

Which, as far as I'm concerned, is double the reason to avoid the nasty bastards.

This. This. This.

The staff member I spoke to kept saying they weren't allowed to 'discriminate'; that's clearly what they'd been told.

Important to keep pointing out that they are discriminating. Just against women of minority faiths and cultures, against women who have been harmed and traumatised by male violence, against women with some disabilities, and against women who just plain demand privacy and dignity. Those women are excluded and discriminated against, actually, by law, ie with a case, because they are being treated less favourably by the store than other women without those characteristics. Stores are putting themselves in a vulnerable legal position. Fair Play for Women have a page stating all this clearly if you feel like printing it off to share.

Transwomen are not being discriminated against under law when refused entry to single sex spaces. Good practice would be to offer a third space to respect their identity and provide the privacy and dignity of not changing in the male sex space.

This is about excluding some female people from any provision at all in order to offer some male people a choice . There is no way to make that sound non discriminatory or not profoundly sexist.

Bullying is an accurate word TimeLady We know that women are being bullied out of our sex based rights, sport, our language and our safe spaces. From #nodebate to all the accusations of TERF and transphobia. It's just a shock when you see companies like M & S adopting that same bullying approach.

That's why hell will freeze over before I start shopping with them again until they reverse their choice to centre the demands of men.

The staff member I spoke to kept saying they weren't allowed to 'discriminate'; that's clearly what they'd been told. She also admitted her female colleagues weren't keen when a transwomen was allowed to use the female staff changing room, but they couldn't complain because that would be 'discrimination'.

Bullied into submission by M&S management it seems.