Marks and Spencer have fallen, part III; we’re gonna need a bigger boat

John Lewis. Arse.
Where can I
A. Try on clothes somewhere single sex.
B. Buy my Christmas presents /school uniforms etc
?

*hits social media

That sounds like a complete cop out. You can’t have a inclusive please use whatever space you want we are open to everyone AND say but staff are able to allow staff to use their own judgement on each case.

So while it sounds like if you try and look female you can come in but if you look like a man we can challenge. But that just makes staff open to being called phobic and or sacked for not keeping to we are inclusive policy. Depending on if it his social media or not.

www.thesun.co.uk/news/10350754/marks-spencer-slammed-men-underwear-reviews/amp/?__twitter_impression=true

John Lewis has just tweeted a reply to Jean Hatchet saying "Thank you for getting in touch. We were surprised to hear that you were given inconsistent feedback from our Partners on this topic as all shop policy is regularly communicated to Partners working in our shops. As an inclusive business, our policy states that customers are welcome to use whichever fitting room makes them feel most comfortable. As a co-owned business, we empower our Partners to use their own judgement on how this policy should be applied on a case-by-case basis. Regardless of specific policy, if any customer were to act inappropriately, the necessary action would be taken."

Isn't that basically the same as M&S? If I'm male but I feel more 'comfortable' trying on clothes in the women's changing rooms, that's just fine.

Oh dear, just received an email from M&S inviting me to take part in an online survey. It would take about five minutes, the email said.

Happy to oblige.

It didn't take five minutes though, more like twenty minutes. It was all those lovely big "open text" boxes wot did it.

I don't care that it was a third party company doing the survey on behalf of M&S. If nothing else, I might have peak-M&Sed someone in that company. Every little helps.

The customers reviewing the lingerie online are registering and listing themselves as male. This is not about gender identities.

Whilst the customers trying it on in-store claim to be female. (Unless of course M&S regularly see men in men's changing rooms trying on lingerie. Not something I would know about.)

Thing is. Are the men writing reviews doing so because they are exhibitionists, or simply because they want to be helpful to other men who might be interested in how comfortable various styles of womens knickers are on a male physique and how they wash.

Similarly are people who say they are women, though may not immediately be recognised as women, and who want access women's changing rooms in order to try on lingerie, primarily interested in exploring comfort and fit.

M&S obviously believe that the motives of both groups are straight forward and product based. Some women are not so sure.

The customers reviewing the lingerie online are registering and listing themselves as male. This is not about gender identities.

But it is, under the Stonewall definition of trans.
Admittedly these are probably AGPs who enjoy the shock factor of listing themselves as male on the site, doesn’t mean it’s not about gender identity. M&S have specifically reached out to a trans group in males where a trained bra fitter helped them choose styles.

The gender identity market is being actively targeted and welcomed by M&S. They need to stop being half hearted about their stance.

The customers reviewing the lingerie online are registering and listing themselves as male. This is not about gender identities.

Just goes to show M&S don’t really welcome the brave and stunning whilst so delicate and feminine. If they did, they would advertise directly to this group with non surgically enhanced, fully intact men wearing women’s lingerie on their website.
Could be seen as transphobic - they clearly like the huge revenue stream generated ( enough to turn away female customers) but not enough to truly stand by their trans customers.

It would be very interesting to see what a shift to using male models (preferably middle aged, since that seems to represent the core customer best) for all their lingerie would have on Christmas sales, as that's when men tend to buy lingerie as gifts rather than for themselves. How many men will want to buy their wife knickers thus advertised?

Given that men make up such a significant, committed and enthusiastic proportion of their online reviews for lingerie.

Plus the fact that store policy has been overhauled to accommodate men unquestioningly into all changing areas.
Plus their proud and, frankly heartbreakingly-tear- inducing, narrative published about reaching out to help nervous males be fitted for bras.

I’m flabbergasted that M&S are not allowing men to model lingerie on their website! Why are you excluding the poor stigmatised men?

Why not be inclusive and show, (let’s say looking at your current reviews) a middle aged male model, with an average male body, wearing a teen bra?

I simply don’t understand it.

But for girls the choice of knickers creates a humongous problem every morning – thong, Brazilian, high briefs, or boy shorts?

The more of an interest men have in roleplaying as us the less they understand us. It's like the fetish is an anti empathy shield.

Come on M&S, stop being so bashful about your target market, get some middle aged men in women’s underwear with their bits tucked in to advertise your lingerie. Or does your inclusivity only stretch to welcoming them into women’s changing rooms and upholding their sleazy reviews on your website?

Good Point. C'mon M&S, where's the inclusivity/diversity in just having females (of all ages and sizes) modelling your lingerie? What about the menz? Your website is clear you already have the contacts.

This guy looks only too wiling to oblige

thetab.com/uk/liverpool/2015/02/20/guide-boys-wearing-girls-knickers-19158

It's a very good point, asking why they don't let men model their knickers and bras, actually.

Something stopping them ?

Is there liquidy stuff on the inside? Why is part of it so matte looking?

On the AIBU thread someone mentioned a Percy Pig muffin, which going by the description above sounds bizarre.

A Percy pig is pink, plumpish, with assorted fruity friends.
A Pervy pig is broadly similar but wearing Ladies underwear .

i.ebayimg.com/images/g/cxYAAOSwtfhYpOi5/s-l300.jpg

It's a disgusting Jelly sweet in the shape of a pig head.

Think of a slimier bigger gummy bear, stuck together with other gummy bears forming a big goopual inside a crisp packet.

That's percy pigs.

Can someone humor the expat and explain what a Percy Pig is? You can't really get the food overseas.

I will be watching M&S to see if they delete any lingerie reviews

Why would they deleted reviews from their target audience?

I will be watching M&S to see if they delete any lingerie reviews

Still standing and they are allowing more to be added on.
They haven’t shown any of their male, customers who they prize so highly wearing any of the lingerie yet. They have women of varying ages, shapes and sizes.
Come on M&S, stop being so bashful about your target market, get some middle aged men in women’s underwear with their bits tucked in to advertise your lingerie. Or does your inclusivity only stretch to welcoming them into women’s changing rooms and upholding their sleazy reviews on your website?

justabaker that woman being sacked for expressing these views is just terrifying, particularly as so many employers are so keen to burnish their woke credentials these days. I can’t see how they can get away with it though - the European court of human rights handed down a decision a few days ago that says that the right to freedom of expression should be secured even in the relationship between employer and employee. I haven’t read the decision itself, just commentary on it, but it suggests that the employer has to show some actual damage to its business interests and that this damage is then balanced against the employee’s right to freedom of expression of their own personal views. I really hope that woman wins her case and other companies sit up and take notice.

it really brought a lump to my throat,” Kelly says.

A lump of vomit, in my case

That link is astonishing Justabaker

Do you know if FPFW have seen it? Given their current focus on sports it might be a good one to forward