Lib Dems actively deterring GC women

That's not the emoji I intended!

Helmet my lack of knowledge demonstrates how easy it is to be conditioned to what is a "fact"!

Thanks 🙏

"Biological women matter"

would fit nicely

Agree @spero. At times like this the previously irrational act of spoiling a ballot paper becomes the only rational option.

"As liberals we believe everyone should believe the same anti-scientific gibberish. Or else".

Let's keep this thread going til the GE. Potential voters deserve to know. Glad to hear they don't want my vote, personally, as they wouldn't have got it anyway.

Justhadathought - completely agree with you. I have always made an effort to vote, mindful of the sacrifices made by so many to allow me this privilege.

But just what am I supposed to do when faced with the cruelty, stupidity and ineptitude of our main parties?

I am going to turn up, to show i was bothered. And spoil my ballot paper. I don't see what other rational response there is.

No one actually records what spoiled ballots say, but they do get read

That is good to know.

If and when I get canvassers knocking on the door and we have a chat, surely I shouldn't tell them who I'm voting for? Obv when they come out with some bollocks stance on women's rights I can tell them they're definitely not getting my vote. But not the other way round.

This is an interesting view - I think a lot of families and communities used to have a lot of secrecy around the vote, but its by no means required or compulsory, though it may be sensible. ;) If you DID tell them who you're voting for, you might get a knock later in the day to remind you to vote.

I live in a Tory safe seat and the tactical voting site advises me to vote Labour. Fat chance

Why not? Who is your Labour candidate. Are they a young Momentum type? Have you any idea of their particular stance on issues that matter to you?

Ahhh thanks Freezer

If and when I get canvassers knocking on the door and we have a chat, surely I shouldn't tell them who I'm voting for?

You can if you want to - it's a secret ballot in the sense that you can keep it secret if you wish and nobody can force you to say how you vote. But you can tell them if you want.

The last time I ballot spoiled (safe labour seat in the locals) I wrote something like ‘women’s rights are for female people’ although I forget the exact phrasing. I had to turn the ballot paper sideways to create enough blank space for a short sentence.

I’ve attended both GE and LE counts in the past and spoiled ballots (along with anything outside of the single cross criteria, such as 3 crosses and a tick) have to be viewed by all the candidates and their electoral agents and agreed as invalid. No one actually records what spoiled ballots say, but they do get read.

I live in a Tory safe seat and the tactical voting site advises me to vote Labour. Fat chance.
As a Remainer, I wanted to vote Lib Dem, but that's out of the question now.
As an individual, my Tory MP is OK in many respects, and has assured me that he is GC.
Feeling politically homeless and helpless....😕

Don't vote then. But please don't suggest you're doing something profound by 'spoiling your ballot'

Spoiling the ballot is not the same as just 'not bothering' to vote. Many people, myself included, take the vote very seriously - and would never dream of 'not voting'.

We all decide on what is meaningful for ourselves, not other people. You can vote for candidates and practices you disagree with if you want. But I'm not quite sure what you see as being so meaningful about that? You are simply condoning that with which you have profound disagreement. Or porhaps issues don't really move you that much?

The Lib Dems are the worst in many respects. They actively say not to vote for them if you are GC. The party excuses all manner of injustice in the name of 'liberalism'. I've had quite a bot of contact with local Lib Dems where I live - and they simoply refuse to take the issue of women's rights, services, spaces and trans children seriously. They just want to be 'nice'.

As it happens I live in an area which will return a Labour MP - and the tories have not a chance in hell. I'd like to vote for my Labour candidate - but the problem is that momentum/Labour has fallen down the trans rabbit hole.....and on top of that there has been behaviour in local constituency parties with which I have a profound problem with - and simply cannot condone.

Okay I've got a deeply stupid question so please be gentle...

I vote by post and always check, check and check again to make sure I've put the correct envelope within the correct envelope because of course it's confidential. If and when I get canvassers knocking on the door and we have a chat, surely I shouldn't tell them who I'm voting for? Obv when they come out with some bollocks stance on women's rights I can tell them they're definitely not getting my vote. But not the other way round.

And then ... so I can sound articulate can someone suggest the best way to ask this question? I have a habit to use 1000 words when 10 would suffice (some of you have noticed, I'm sure ) so I want to get straight to the jugular without scaring them away immediately.

That's why you'd write REMAIN on it.

I think it's really difficult to know what to do. It is regularly argued that because the Labour Party policy was pro Brexit in 2017, everyone who voted Labour was endorsing Brexit. However, realistically spoiled Ballot Papers wouldn't have been understood as an endorsement for Remain. The consequence would just have been a Conservative majority.

If you are going to spoil your ballot, state the reason, it will be noted.

Don't vote then. But please don't suggest you're doing something profound by 'spoiling your ballot'.

I'll always vote for who I personally consider to be the least bad option.

You don't vote for Hillary, you get a Trump.

You didn't vote for Hitler's opposition, you got a Hitler.

That's the political system we live in. Meanwhile, we campaign, we discuss, we provide evidence, we carry on fighting.

Yes please don't spoil your ballot

Yes, don't do that because voting means nothing at all..It is just an intellectual & dishonest exercise. Politics is a meaning free zone.

It is meaningless and I really find it upsetting that people seem to think their spoiled paper is collected, investigated, researched or that people will act upon it. Hint: They don't.
Your spoiled paper will be dismissed as one of the many papers spoiled because of Brexit, the climate, dogs, pensions, etc, etc

So you suggest that people should vote for candidates who say, or act on, things that you profoundly disagree with?

That you vote for parties that actively say they don't want the likes of you to vote for them?

And you suggest that what political parties say and do does not really matter, because you will vote for them, anyway?

That people can stand for things they don't really believe in, and that others will not stand up for what they do really believe in, and that is all fine? That politicians will lie and tell untruths for reasons of political expediency, but that is perfectly acceptable?

You seem to suggest that voting itself is meaningless - because people will vote without any real feeling or passion anyway - just because they always have, or because that is their habit?

I suggest this goes to the very heart of the problem with contemporary party politics. None of it means anything other than strategic game playing and acting out of tradition and habit.

I will not vote for anyone who stands for things that I profoundly disagree with - on issues that I consider to be of FIRST ORDER SIGNIFICANCE.

A victim of domestic abuse was removed as a judge of a radical thinking prize and “hounded” out of her role within the Liberal Democrats for saying that she did not believe that men who identified as women should have access to women’s refuges.

Natalie Bird, 38, a mother of two who fled an abusive former partner, was accused of “dangerous transphobia” by transgender activists in the party. She had said that opening up safe spaces without proper safeguards to anyone who said that they were female could put women at risk.

She opposed segregating women’s refuges by chosen gender instead of biological sex, and said that it was not fair to make female victims of domestic violence, abuse and rape share services with people…

Found the above on The Times. The LibDems seem to be very liberal with intolerance of others.

Yes please don't spoil your ballot

There were so many spoiled ballots at the last round of elections that this fact was mentioned in the national media.

It is meaningless and I really find it upsetting that people seem to think their spoiled paper is collected, investigated, researched or that people will act upon it.
Hint: They don't.
Your spoiled paper will be dismissed as one of the many papers spoiled because of Brexit, the climate, dogs, pensions, etc, etc.

Also it is important to tell all local candidates that this is what you intend to do, & why.