Play equipment is a feminist issue

Oh you have it already - didn't see when I first scrolled sorry

This is worth a watch - how Barcelona is addressing such issues -

www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/world-50269778/what-would-a-city-designed-by-women-be-like

(Apologies if already covered)

The exclusion of girls and women from outside spaces and physical activity starts at a young age.

For example a girl in my son's reception class (so age four or five) gets told every morning by her mum that she can't run around on the grass with the boys because she will get her feet wet, because girls' school shoes tend to be flimsy strappy things that don't cover the foot. So my son and his boy friends have fun and physical activity while she is excluded. Makes me so sad for her.

I only have sons and see this kind of thing over and over again. Boys encouraged to get outside, be physically active, get muddy while girls are restricted even at very young ages.

Came across this on twitter and it reminded me of this thread- a Girlguide comment on how two thirds of the 11-21 year old females they asked said they couldn't find outdoor sports facilities they felt safe using. The replies are what people who think girls are humans and not gendervalidators would say.

It has a link to an article about young folks not exercising enough.
twitter.com/Girlguiding/status/1197866572292997122

Of course everyone doesn’t have to want to do it but if you can skate competently you do have the skill level and the physique to ramp skate. It’s an extreme sport and it’s not for everyone for all sorts of reasons but it’s not something that requires super skill levels or a great physique and people shouldn’t feel put off trying it if they are interested but not super fit.

Anyone skilled enough to roller skate competently can ramp skate. It’s just our own mental blocks that stop us

Nope. Complete lack of will and desire on my part. I like my bones unbroken and my teeth uncracked. I don't want to put the will, time and energy in. I just liked going round and round.

I didn't have that level of skill or the physique.

Anyone skilled enough to roller skate competently can ramp skate. It’s just our own mental blocks that stop us. I started as a 40 year old woman and once I worked up the courage to roll down my first tiny ramp I was hooked. It’s actually pretty easy compared to roller dance/figure skating. Check out women like IndyJammaJones for encouraging tutorials or Chicks in Bowls for empowerment and an amazing growing culture. Ramp roller skating is exploding in popularity and it’s very female dominated.

I'm sure there is some literature about this ... I remember reading it. It made the point that not only do most girls not use these facilities but that they appeal only to a small subset of boys too - in other words, a lot of money goes into facilities that serve only a small number of young people overall. Then they say that they have 'provided for' young people when they really haven't.

As a girl, I went roller skating and ice-skating on rinks, not parks. I don't think I could ever have managed the parks/ramps. I didn't have that level of skill or the physique. I was quite happy to go round and round to music I liked. There were also tennis courts and a netball court we had access to.

On that note, it's worth making sure that kids know that when it comes to endurance, the difference between men and women narrows massively. There is possibly* only a 13 minute difference in the world marathon records between the fastest man and woman. Considering that in many sports, the best women's competitors are at a similar level to any decent young adult man, that's pretty amazing. Any man running a marathon in 2 and a quarter hours is considered extremely athletic and the best women can do that too. It's not an equal ability but it's actually very close. And once you pass into ultra endurance the few women in the field can outperform the men by quite a lot at the elite level. The women's records can be very significantly better than the men's.

And while obviously you can't get children or teens to practice endurance/ultra endurance unless you want to potentially kill them. But for both girls and boys to grow up knowing that there are fields of sport where women excel, is really, really important.

*The fastest woman's marathon time is still awaiting ratification.

Just catching up with this thread. One thing I'm trying to do with the young girls in my life is encourage them to do physical activities where they can compete with (or outcompete) the boys. Namely things like gymnastics, rock climbing, dance, ice skating, trampolining.

The reason being that I think it really grows their confidence. I remember vividly the last time I played football in the park. I was about 13-14, getting constantly outrun and brutally tackled by the other boys. It totally knocked my confidence and I stopped playing altogether.

I now do rock climbing pretty seriously and it's fantastic to go to the climbing gym and see the women absolutely schooling the men there. I love watching women's football and rugby but we also need to champion the sports where women are not always second tier to the men.

As a woman something I love about going to the skate park (other than skating) is that just by being there, I'm sending a message to girls that this is a space for them too. And a message to boys that women are cool. I so, so often see little girls passing by the skate park stop to look at me. So I go over to them, have a chat, do a trick for them if they ask, suggest that they can do this too.

I chat to the boys, let them see that this cool, fun thing they are doing isn't just their domain. I don't make any point to them other just being there. I think it's so insanely important to be that example to both boys and girls. And to their parents, because I honestly think that parents are so often the worst culprits when it comes to gendering the activities their kids do.

You are totally on the button OP.

If we are spending money on facilities that boys use mostly we need to understand why what we are providing isn’t doing it for the girls! So much of this is down to design and use of space and the feeling of safety and not intimidation. We have a BMX track nearby and it is really amazing- a brilliant thing for youth locally and used by kids from 7+ to adult. A very small number of feisty girls use it - and indeed do amazingly and compete internationally. But it’s such a small percentage.

Gosh. I'm horrified that I have never realised this. You are correct of course op.

I think the problem is that if there isn't somebody there to mediate and make sure that a facility is shared, a bigger stronger group will dominate... and physically teenage boys are bigger and stronger than teenage girls.

I would like us to stop attributing lack of participation as indicative of lack of interest. We don't spend public money on equipment that fits women, so women try something it, they can be more likely to injure themselves or perceive that they're not good at something. Sometimes, it really is the tool, not the person.
That reminded me of something I heard many years ago (so may be different now).
Ski hire places usually only have men's boot to hire. Boots that fit women are wider in the calf (or such like) so the boots we rent are often very uncomfortable for women. I certainly found this. I was so happy to discover cross country skiing as it was like wearing slippers in comparison.

I'm a Guide Leader (don't shoot me) and our unit are very active and outdoorsy. One of the things that strikes me about the girls is how they almost get younger when they come to Guides. I think it's a combination of things - no boys, all female companions, uniform and the opportunity to do activities in a non judgemental environment. No one judges you on your abilities or appearance. Meanness is discouraged by the Leader and actually reinforced by the girls.
Girls do enjoy sports and activities - even the ones who probably don't at school, actually they probably enjoy it because they're not at school.
It's really heartening to see.

What Arnold says above about girls simply stopping playing at a certain age, reminds me of my teenage years.

Going through the Wellcome Play exhibition made me think how much the school uniform interfered with some of the very active play. Eg, having to wear a full-skirted below-the-knee dress interfered with leap-frogging over obstacles.

A spontaneous pick-up netball game wasn't practical because of the same dresses/tunics.

I recently noticed that when I had to use a publicly-funded Outdoor Education Centre's boats not one of them was sized to fit me and were in danger of injuring me. I'm a small paddler, I'm not a small woman.

I would like us to stop attributing lack of participation as indicative of lack of interest. We don't spend public money on equipment that fits women, so women try something it, they can be more likely to injure themselves or perceive that they're not good at something. Sometimes, it really is the tool, not the person.

I wanted to report that, on the back of this thread, I've put forward a brief to be discussed at council level about viewing our ward's playgrounds and green spaces through the lens of the Public Sector Equality Duty.

I've come up with an idea to be costed that could very well broaden green space appeal to girls, the disabled, and the elderly, and solve an ongoing anti-social behaviour issue.

This thread really caught my attention, and I've taken the action that is currently available to me.

Lets see how it goes.

I think there's a lot of truth to what others have said about girls entering puberty earlier and abandoning physical activities they associate with childhood. Weightlifting has become very popular with young women thanks to Instagrammers, I think this could have a lot of appeal for young girls. You could argue it's catering to the male gaze (how to 'grow your butt' and lots of glamourous unrealistic shots in sportswear etc), but if it hooks them in does it really matter? Appealing to boys is going to be part of their focus at that age anyway, but the wonderful side effect of weightlifting is that no matter the reasons for starting, it raises self-esteem and makes one aware of the amazing ways a body can develop and push past limits, both psychological and physical.

Around 13/14 we did just stop. I don't think it was because we wanted to look nice and non-sweaty for the boys (I wasn't interested in boys at that age).I think we just considered it childish. I remember thinking the boys were juvenile for running around playing all the time.We wanted to sit around and chat and have a laugh, and be more grown up.

This reflects a lot of my own experience. Girls do tend to enter puberty and want to feel grown up earlier than boys do, and for some reason many sports are seen as "playing". I don't think it's helpful to assume that developmental differences don't play a role in what's going on.
I also found getting my period at 12 made a difference, as I had a heavy flow sometimes and tampons weren't reliable, and also some significant cramping in the early teen years. It means that I wasn't keen to participate on certain days, especially anything like dance or swimming. But it wasn't really the thing to join any organised activity and then back out a week a month.
Then I also became much more heavily involved in some other types of activities.
All this stuff kind of came together to push me in another direction.

One of the issues with council funding such activities is that it is almost wholly dependent on who applies, and you need a history of operation and established bank accounts.

This is the difficulty I found when I realised almost all our small grants were going towards male sporting activities. In order to redress the balance, I had to find people who offered female sporting activities and introduce them to the idea of applying for council funding. And this is outreach work, and not really part of my role. Then because I had done this work, I then had to recuse myself from the vote, which meant I had to lobby behind the scenes to ensure the grant would pass.

For one small grant of £500 to pass, it took me about five hours of lobbying other councillors (taking people out for lunch to talk through the issue etc) and two of those votes were quid pro quo, so I will be expected to vote for one of their pet projects at a later date.

A lot of male sporting activities have been going for years, have established histories, and clear accounts, plus they usually have someone in board that understands council funding and usually someone on the board with a connection to the council. So their applications tend to come in complete, and pass easily. Again, they are "recognised" sports, so it is easier for councillors to understand what they are funding.

I do have to say, part of the problem is that there aren't enough females councillors in many areas, so different perspectives don't always exist. And where there are female councillors, they can often be restricted by party lines and cannot operate independently on issues. And there's way too much national politics at local level these days, and it just wastes time and focuses on stuff local councils cannot do anything about at the detriment to things we can actually change.

What Arnold says above about girls simply stopping playing at a certain age, reminds me of my teenage years.
I was at secondary school in the late 80s.
Around 13/14 we did just stop. I don't think it was because we wanted to look nice and non-sweaty for the boys (I wasn't interested in boys at that age).
I think we just considered it childish. I remember thinking the boys were juvenile for running around playing all the time.
We wanted to sit around and chat and have a laugh, and be more grown up.

Perhaps it's a 'clean thing'.
They prefer to stay looking clean and fresh, not get sweaty and muddy, especially with long hair.
All at a much younger age.