Please or to access all these features

Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Always (sanitary towells) forced to remove Venus logo

287 replies

QwertySmalls · 20/10/2019 09:44

From The Fail unfortunately maybe someone can find another source but I cant see one atm.

Transgender lobby forces sanitary towel-maker Always to ditch Venus logo from its products

Sanitary towel pad maker now kowtows to transgender activists born female
They removed the feminine Venus symbol from its products after complaints
Butmany of Always’s female customers have responded angrily to the move
Sanitary towels with the new packaging will arrive in the stores by January 2020

www.google.com/amp/s/www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7592413/amp/Transgender-lobby-forces-ditch-female-logo-sanitary-towels.html

OP posts:
Raindrops17 · 21/10/2019 23:22

@NellieEllie I've seen a PP share a similar reply from 'Karen'. Looks like a copy and paste job!

To be fair, I used to work in a customer service department of a company that didn't communicate well and we were always the last to know any changes (often told by the customer!) so I can believe 'Karen' may not know about any changes!

ErrolTheDragon · 21/10/2019 23:17

I'm wondering if it''s allowed to post entire artcles here, or if there is some kind of MN rule about this?

I think it's a general breach of copyright to c&p whole articles (not an MN rule specifically). But I think a few selected quotes are ok. Suggest you report your post and ask MN to delete it if it's not ok.

The times sharetokens are fine as that's a mechanism they've created to allow sharing of links. Subscribers can only do a limited number each day, I think.

Beamur · 21/10/2019 23:07

That's a terrible response!

LordProfFekkoThePenguinPhD · 21/10/2019 23:07

They didn’t even answer me!

NellieEllie · 21/10/2019 23:01

Customer Services at “Always” have got back to me with a stupendously appalling reply. I cannot decide what is worse, the spelling, or the utter lack of any attempt to answer the query. Here it is:

“Thanks for your email, and inquiry. I have checked the history of the products and see no mention of any wrapper changes. If their will be an upcoming change, this would not be shared with us until it happens.

If you would like to voice your opinion one way or the other, I will gladly pass that on to mae your voice heard.
Thank you for your most valuable time and inquiry. Please contact us anytime with questions or comments, we are here for you, !

Kindest regards,

Karen
Always Team
Need to get back in touch? Please do not change the subject line, just hit reply. This makes sure we receive your message.”

MonChatEstMagnifique · 21/10/2019 22:25

And it’s also the contrast in attitude. Women have objected for ages to Always making nearly all their products scented, both because of smell and irritations, and get ignored.

Yes, I would be interested to know how they conduct their research if it's telling them that the vast majority of women want scented products. How are they wording the questions? Do you want scented sanitary towels may give a very different answer to are you concerned about hygiene/smell when having a period? Many women may answer yes to the second question but that doesn't mean they want stinky sanitary towels!

MonChatEstMagnifique · 21/10/2019 22:19

It is systematic removal of women, of women’s spaces, of women’s voices, of women’s identity, of women’s biology.

I think this is different. If all sanitary products had always had this logo on, then I would see your point more.

I'm presuming Always haven't had the logo on for very long as I have many different types in my wardrobe from trying them out and I've looked today and most don't carry the logo. I also have lots of other brands and none of them have it on either. So it's hardly erasing women when it never used to exist on at least some Always and other brand sanpro.

EmpressLesbianInChair · 21/10/2019 22:10

And it’s also the contrast in attitude. Women have objected for ages to Always making nearly all their products scented, both because of smell and irritations, and get ignored.

A transman makes a complaint about something that makes no difference to the product & is immediately prioritised.

Birdsfoottrefoil · 21/10/2019 22:03

tilder in isolation I would agree it isn’t, but this is not something that is taking place in isolation. It is systematic removal of women, of women’s spaces, of women’s voices, of women’s identity, of women’s biology.

tilder · 21/10/2019 20:35

I don't have periods (thanks Merina) but even my 6 year old knows girls have periods, boys don't.

I couldn't find confirmation of the changes on the Always twitter feed. But I did find reference to a new colour scheme. Not the green requested, but pink, purple and blue. My first thought was Hmm second was maybe the Venus symbol will appear on the pink. Just to make sure women buy the correct colour.

Btw I have huge sympathy with people who struggle wifh periods. Am not convinced a symbol on a towel is the big issue though.

Lamahaha · 21/10/2019 20:32

Ooops. I'm wondering if it''s allowed to post entire artcles here, or if there is some kind of MN rule about this? I know that Times articles are posted with a share token. Please let me know asap, and if so I'll report.

Lamahaha · 21/10/2019 20:31

Here's the text to the Telegraph article, behind a paywall, linked above. Someone posted it on my FB.

“Always are to remove the Venus symbol from their packaging in December.

Always, the sanitary pad brand, has given in to claims of discrimination by transgender men and removed the ‘Venus’ symbol of the female sex from its wrapping. A trans activist tweeted in July asking Always why it was necessary to have the sign on their sanitary wear.

The tweet read: ‘There are non-binary and trans folks who still need to use your products too you know!’

One of the defining moments for me, and for most females on the planet, was when I started menstruating. I was 12-years-old, and it was 1974. It wasn’t that common for girls to have been sat down by their mother and told what to expect before it actually happened, and when my period came, I felt anxiety and more than a little embarrassment.

But today, things are different thankfully. Increasingly, girls are taught from an early age that menstruation is a natural process, and nothing to be frightened or ashamed of. Until of course, the extreme trans activists got involved.

Always replied that, “We are glad to inform you that as of December we will use a wrapper design without the feminine symbol.” The brand’s public relations team added that the change is set to come in late 2019 and that gender-neutral period products would hit stores in January of 2020.

Wow. If only us feminists could get a result as significant as a major brand changing its entire marketing strategy so easily. I wish it only took a tweet or two to pressurise advertisers into ditching sexist and demeaning images of women, for example. But, usually, we are simply ignored.

To add insult to injury, the announcement from Always that it would be eliminating any mention of the female sex from its products was made on “National Period Day,” devised to strive towards “menstrual equity.” Some trans activists even claim that trans women (natal males) can have “period-like” symptoms once a month.

Earlier this year, I wrote about Kenny, a trans man chosen to front the 'I’m On' campaign, which aimed to take the stigma out of periods. I said then, as I will say now, that choosing a person who hated her female body to the point of transitioning, as an ambassador for such a campaign sent exactly the wrong message.

But of course, the trans activists now have a stranglehold on much of our culture and legislation. I’m sure that those behind 'I’m On' felt that it was much more important to be suitably woke than to make real material changes for girls and young women.

The increased and wholly unreasonable demands of the extreme trans activists are usually met with fear and instant capitulation. We are told that terms such as “pregnant women” and “breastfeeding” are now transphobic.

It is not enough to accept trans women for who they are, but rather we are now bullied into saying that they are "real women".

But they are not. And trans men are still, however much this pains them to admit it, natal females. That means, in the immortal words of Alice Cooper: ‘Only Women Bleed’.

If this craziness goes any further, women will not be allowed to name ourselves as such, for fear that we will be branded bigots. We will be required to call ourselves 'cisgender', and refer to trans women merely as ‘women’.

Not only are biological men, including sex offenders, allowed in women’s prisons, hospitals, hostels, and refuges, we now have a situation, reported this week, that a number of police forces are recording suspected and convicted rapists as female if they no longer wish to identify with their male birth sex. This means that if a woman is raped by a man, who later decides to identify as female, and the case gets to court, the victim would have to refer to the man that raped her as ‘she’.

Women’s rights are not only being eliminated, but the right to be a woman, is being extended to men. This Orwellian madness has to stop. The likes of Always should not cave in to trans activists, but rather should recognise that the people boosting their profits and using their product are women - and only women.”

LordProfFekkoThePenguinPhD · 21/10/2019 20:01

It’s a bloody disgrace.

Birdsfoottrefoil · 21/10/2019 19:58

I’m sure the school has way more disabled or special needs kids than trans kids. What are they doing for them?

Being inclusive doesn’t mean they include them. SN or disabled kids count even less than women in the world of inclusivity - unless they can be persuaded that the reason they don’t fit in is because they are actually trans.

LordProfFekkoThePenguinPhD · 21/10/2019 19:54

I’ve just been gathering together my sanpro stock of Always Never More (craaaawww).

Nighttime (industrial strength) almost empty pack - no symbols
Normal wings stuff (brought in the US) - no symbols
Tampons - garish but not still symbols
Then bingo - another industrial strength nighttime ones - symbols galore (a newer pack, only one take out).

So they have done all this for a small % of their packaging anyway? Talk about shooting yourself in the foot.

Funnily enough only the tampax has the word ‘woman’ on it (for more than 80 years Tampax has been trusted by women around the world - not any more mate).

My nice new ones are in a pale cream cover, smells of nothing - absolutely nothing - organic cotton, biodegradable, cardboard box, vegan society and ethical awards tagged, no chlorine, plastic or bleach and their website and twitter account says ‘woman’.

Why are we using other brands again? Habit?

acatcalledjohn · 21/10/2019 19:27

Found you! I started the other thread this afternoon after opening my browser and finding the Huff Post article on the home page.

And there's me thinking that how you identify is irrelevant when it comes to flushing out your uterus on roughly four-weekly basis.
I don't know about other women, but my body still does its thing when I'm make-up free and in my masculine baggy jeans and trainers. How I identify doesn't play a role in the biology of my body.

I peak transed some time ago now. This news made me peak trans all over again.

If you are triggered by the mere sight of the Venus symbol and the fact only biological females are capable of bleeding out of their vaginas then your first call should be to psychological support, not P&G.

I'll be looking in to changing away from P&G products as much as I can.

LordProfFekkoThePenguinPhD · 21/10/2019 18:49

I’m sure the school has way more disabled or special needs kids that trans kids. What are they doing for them?

EmpressLesbianInChair · 21/10/2019 18:42

We are a Stonewall approved school. But it only seems to be about promoting trans rights.

It would be. Stonewall are homophobic & misogynist & particularly dislike lesbians.

They tried to get the same-sex exemptions removed from the Equality Act, they’ve tried to get lesbians arrested on multiple occasions (me twice) for protesting about lesbian rights outside their conferences, and when asked whether women’s concerns about unisex toilets, rape shelters etc were reasonable, Ruth Hunt replied ‘Men are always going to rape women.’

LordProfFekkoThePenguinPhD · 21/10/2019 18:24

The photo used - looked like the inside of a large child’s nappy. These poor women must be walking like ducks.

PerspicaciaTick · 21/10/2019 18:23

To be fair, there have been plenty of threads on MN over the years reporting that Always pads give women rashes and soreness. I can't imagine how uncomfortable the Kenya version is.

LordProfFekkoThePenguinPhD · 21/10/2019 18:06

Oh dear Always. If only you’d kept your trap shut... Didn’t your PR team/dept follow Floragate?

From BBC Africa twitter: Kenyan women are using the Twitter hashtag #MyAlwaysExperience to express outrage over the Always brand of sanitary pads, which they say causes rashes, burns and discomfort. the accompanying phots is of the ‘nice’ towels sold elsewhere and the ones sold in Kenya that look like a nylon bolster cushion.

LordProfFekkoThePenguinPhD · 21/10/2019 16:52

I’ve actually had an epiphany today. I totally get it now.

Inclusion to me means access for all - so, for those in wheelchairs, visually impaired, maybe pushing a pram and slinging a baby, etc with me so far?

So to make, say a tube station or bus accessible- they’d need to spend a fortune on lifts, ramps, signage etc. Right?

Inclusive - if they just means paint a rainbow on it and say he/she/they then voila! Inclusivity in spades for the price of a few transfers and bullying emails to staff.

Do I win a cookie?

teawamutu · 21/10/2019 15:56

Censorship isn’t a medical treatment.

Nailed it.

BuzzShitbagBobbly · 21/10/2019 15:51

I am not a personal pad-buyer, but I now know what brand to explicitly AVOID when buying sanitary products for foodbanks.
(Ditto other P&G stuff)

TheChampagneGalop · 21/10/2019 15:44

twitter.com/hashtag/MyAlwaysExperience?src=hashtag_click
Oh dear. Always are also selling lower quality pads in African countries - women report getting rashes and burns from them.

What a female-friendly company!!

Swipe left for the next trending thread