Please or to access all these features

Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Woke DD and women in sports

84 replies

ElfrideSwancourt · 19/10/2019 17:27

My eldest DD has recently finished at a woker than woke uni and is terribly woke now. She would consider herself a feminist but just doesn't get the issues with self ID and sport.

I usually avoid the subject because her attitude is one of the few things that we disagree on, but I did bring up women's sports today.

She tried all the usual 'but aren't they entitled to do sport' arguments but I just kept centering the women and how massively unfair it is and she just had no answers .

I'm really hoping that I have sowed some seeds, and now she is not at uni she will start to see the light.

OP posts:
Goosefoot · 19/10/2019 18:13

I think the thing to ask young women thinking this way is, why do we have separate women's events? Normally excluding one sex would be sexism and even illegal, so why is it considered necessary to do it in this case - why not simply have all mixed sex teams?

Even if she comes to the conclusion that it would be best to have totally mixed sex teams, it would probably be a temporary situation until the realities of what that would mean become clear to her through experience.

WineGummyBear · 19/10/2019 17:50

This isn't about anyone's entitlement to do sport. This is about everyone's entitlement to do sport. And that's why we have categories. For age, for sex, for disabilities. Everyone is entitled to participate. Safely. Fairly.

The categories are based on (mostly) objective (mostly) observable biological criteria.

What no-one is entitled to do is pick their own category, according to some abstract idea about their own identity.

Except increasingly it's an option to select your own category for sex. Patently this confers an advantage to one group.

BarbaraStrozzi · 19/10/2019 17:45

Does your DD play any sports herself? (Not that that's any guarantee - I know a woker-than-woke cyclist who is very pro McK. She's one of these young libfems totally mired in confusion and cognitive dissonance: for some reason "ladybrains" and all sorts of associated beliefs about hard-wired femininity pose no threat to women being taken seriously, but in her muddled mind if one admits that women can run faster/throw further, somehow this will lead to the whole edifice of feminism collapsing.

Winesalot · 19/10/2019 17:42

Thought the latest Karolinska Institutet (Sweden) research was a great start. “Our study supports a causal effect of testosterone on physical performance, as measured by running time to exhaustion, in young healthy women,”

I think future research will continue to clarify the situation. It is a problem of trying to make significant decisions that effect sport when there is just not enough longitudinal research.

Pota2 · 19/10/2019 17:34

Just tell her that the best option is to have unisex sport and that all categories are hateful because what about non-binary people? Obviously it will only be males who win but that’s okay in the name of stamping out hate. Play her at her own woke game. Maybe she will get it in 10 years, though from the looks of it, maybe she won’t.

DontBuyANewMumCashmere · 19/10/2019 17:33

Does she know about Fallon Fox (MMA fighter) breaking Tamika Brent's skull?
And Hannah wotsisface breaking a woman's femur during an Australian Football game?

I'm a rugby player. I'm 6' and when I was playing I was overweight so I'm no teeny tiny fragile little woman...
But if I had a 6' male bodied person ready to smash into me for a full contact tackle, I'd shit myself and leave the team (and probably the sport) for good.

Ask her if that's fair!

If she tries the 'aren't TW entitled to do sport' argument you should say Yes ofc they should be able to participate in sport, but not to chose their opponents.

Hope she sees sense soon.

MIdgebabe · 19/10/2019 17:32

I hope you reassured her that you would be more than happy for them to compete in sport. Either as their own sex, or in some tailored competition

Whatsnewpussyhat · 19/10/2019 17:31

They are entitled to compete with their own sex class.

quincejamplease · 19/10/2019 17:28

God that's depressing.

Swipe left for the next trending thread