Can we take a moment to appreciate Piers Morgan

and I'm sure everyone has heard of Karen White

I very much doubt that. The rest of the world really isn't as obsessed by trans issues as FWR is.

But the truth is, most people aren't aware of it. They have no idea that men are being put in women's prisons, or women's wards, or in women's refuges, or are playing in women's sports

I disagree, I've overhead men talking about "this nonsense" many times, I've seen men openly talking on forums about it (ridiculing it) and I'm sure everyone has heard of Karen White.
Of course there are some people who don't know the extent of it (especially self ID), but I wouldn't say most people.

For this to stop being a niche issue that only feminists are concerned about, we need someone to make it mainstream. If Piers Morgan is that person, then so be it. He wouldn't be my first choice, but boy, is he good at getting publicity. Morgan could be instrumental in getting the tide turned on this whole thing.

Yes.

The other thing I think we need to remember is this. As gender-critical feminists, we are very very aware of this issue. We talk about it on Mumsnet and on Twitter and in secret groups on Facebook. We eagerly read every article on the issue published in the Sunday Times or the Mail on Sunday. Some of us attend meetings in real life too.

But the truth is, most people aren't aware of it. They have no idea that men are being put in women's prisons, or women's wards, or in women's refuges, or are playing in women's sports. They certainly have no idea about the government's proposals to implement self ID. And the vast majority of politicians have either bought into the TRA narrative or are too cowardly to speak out. So far one solitary MP, David Davies, has taken a public position on this. Remember James Kirkup saying that a number of MPs were very worried about self-ID but were terrified of saying anything publicly?

For this to stop being a niche issue that only feminists are concerned about, we need someone to make it mainstream. If Piers Morgan is that person, then so be it. He wouldn't be my first choice, but boy, is he good at getting publicity. Morgan could be instrumental in getting the tide turned on this whole thing.

I don't think we should be allowed to say what we think if it's racist. Certainly not in public and on the telly. Or misogynist, come to that.

The problem I have with this is it enables this approach of getting certain buzzwords or ideas labeled racist or whatever, and no one even thinks any more, you just utter the word and you're out. It doesn't even seem to matter in many instances if the idea is true empirically. Surely there is quite a lot of room for discussion on many questions?

More generally, it's been my observation that in the media, and also in academia, the people who end up holding the line for freedom of speech or academic integrity and freedom can often be rather difficult and even abrasive, and overly sure of their own opinions and value. But maybe it's the case that we need people like that, and that includes those of us who might have strong opinions but tend to be less abrasive or outspoken.

I agree OP.

And I've no time for tribalism.

I'm not keen on Piers and I'll never get over him criticising Ariana Grande for going back to America after the Manchester attack. In this case though I'm right behind him.

I struggle with Piers because I don't like him, his approach or his actions from his time as Editor - but on this I agree.

It shows me that sometimes I can find common ground even with people I detest for the majority of their views.

FWIW, I've always agreed with him on gun control, and I do actually think he was reasonably courageous about consistently speaking up about it when he puts a lot of store in his friendship with the US President and there are very powerful interests who are very against people who point out the gun problem in America with forthrightness. I've just yet to see quite that level of courage from him about this topic, and the last time I paid much attention to his Twitter feed he was questioning the manliness of a dad carrying his own baby, so it's not bowling me over yet. But who knows? There's weird shit happening all over the place right now.

Look, Piers is never going to advance the cause of radical feminism. Or socialist/Marxist feminism (my kind, more or less). Frankly, nor are most Britons, whether they watch GMB or not.

But he might be able to highlight enough of the outrages of extremist genderism to at least get public opinion triggered enough for it to become politically inconvenient for the queer theory project to advance further than it already has.

I'm not going to throw the baby out with the bath water (or stop advocating for more actual feminism) just because Piers is, as Bezalelle rightly points out, a knobber.

Pax.

I actually agree with Piers sometimes

I love this guy. He is a bit silly sometimes but I think he does it to highlight how nuts everything is becoming. I for one would champion him and this morning's debate made me think 'don't get me started' about trans ppl entering women's sports and taking all the medals it is something that makes my blood boil. Also now hospitals are letting men who identify as women but who have not transitioned or taken any hormones (to all intents and purposes men) into women's bays on wards and there have been issues resulting from this. So yes keep Piers on air. 100 different genders? Do me a favour!

(Offers hugs if needed)

I wouldn't have expected anything less from you than that manipulative passive aggressive response

I"d like to apologise for losing my temper this morning. It's been a ridiculously stressful week and I reacted with far too much over sensitivity to what was well intentioned being pleased that people are beginning to take note, and a hope that things may change on the part of the OP. It's wasn't passive aggressive, it was straight up angry, and the situation didn't warrant it, and I have no particular desire to see enemies when there are friends.

Pax.

A lot of people watch him in the morning.
So if him talking about this issue spreads the word re how stupid slef ID is, I don’t care whose saying it, I’m just pleased they are.

He's generally a knobber, but even a stopped clock is right twice a day.

I imagine, also, that you would have to be one hell of a raging, frothing misogynist to truly not grasp the insanity of trans ideology. Anyone with an ounce of intelligence, or self analysis, would be aghast at how the public is being duped.

Women's sports, transing children, etc. These are issues that are not going to be confined to a few feminists.

Also I feel like the constant debating about whether we do or don't like a particular person who's speaking out against the overreaches of trans activists isn't really a useful way to frame things. The more people speaking out the better. We won't like all of them, and there will be some who some of us like and others don't. Everyone who's concerned about what's happening has the right to speak out. More voices coming at things from more angles is a good thing.

Just because someone voices an opinion that I also share, doesn't mean I have to support them or like them or agree with anything else they say, whether it's Piers Morgan, KH, JHB, Nick Griffin, whoever.

I don't think it's necessarily courageous, I think in fact it's playing to a certain audience, and self-serving shit stirring.

Agreed, Datun. Sunlight is the best disinfectant and all. The fact that it's been so taboo to talk about what's happening in any detail and the resulting cluelessness of most of the public is how things got this far.

I hate him on GMB. He constantly undermines and talks over Susannah Reid (who I don't like either). He is deliberately goady in an almost Katie Hopkins style.

However, he has caused a storm on social media like no one else has previously on this issue. There are now two petitions, one to have him fired and one to keep him. I did smile a bit when he gave the one to have him fired publicity by retweeting it himself and adding some sarcastic comment.

I have no doubt that his motives are self serving. But the ripple effect could have positive consequences for women's rights.

Ah I see!!!

They are just ordinary men
I have tried to raise this before but they had never heard about and I think they thought it was just a few men getting dressed up

But suddenly they are talking about.

Because they watch piers in the morning

Excellent, littl.

There is a certain symmetry to all this.

Gender ideology seems to have found favour because we have such a highly gendered society now. And people can't cope with the boxes they're shoved into.

But as more people realise how damaging it is, the gender critical position gets airtime and sunlight.

Gender as a harmful set of stereotypical behaviours is something that a lot of people haven't thought about.

Which is why I do genuinely believe that transactivism will actually do the job of gender criticism. I've never seen it go the other way.