Old Vic Loos

Well yes, this is the interesting thing for me - seeing trans activists decrying the mixed sex toilet provision. They've actually been at the forefront of using it as an argument to belittle women demanding single sex spaces. But now it's actually happened, there's a growing clamour from TRAs like Willoughby and others who want the sex separation to remain because they want to be able to use it. Obviously, when they do, it becomes mixed sex anyway, but as with so much, this is about maintaining the outward illusion to bolster the ephemeral feelings. In that sense, the Enbys and the Trans activists are on the same page. It's all about feelings. Theirs, natch.

So yeah basically a new fancy loo for men.

Another perspective I've accidentally stumbled on:

(I've just noticed a weird thing; followed the link to the Sarah Ditum thread where I have 50 likes for a tweet I did in the thread on my own twitter app. Only 7 on the Internet. Is that de boosting?! Jesus!)

I'd be interested to know what the queues are like at the Old Vic.

I was there during the refurb, I thought it seemed too good to be true but then there were so many signs up about women's toilets, I thought perhaps it was true and that I'd just become paranoid.

This type of brother me these days...

www.yorkshireeveningpost.co.uk/news/crime/police-appeal-after-secret-camera-discovered-in-toilet-of-west-yorkshire-costa-coffee-1-10038306

Unisex loo...

(It seems to me that a substantial majority of men will want not to intrude on women and children, and if there are any that would want to, being forced to announce that in public will filter out quite of few of them).

We don't have to go in to the loos with urinals.

We just have to stand outside them and explain to arriving men that there may be women and children in there, and ask them to go elsewhere. (There is, obviously, no "elsewhere").

Make men complain about the lack of single sex loos too.

Yes, I suppose so. There are definitely women clearly devoted to screwing over the boundaries and rights of other women, and some of them even call themselves feminists when they do it, so yes, everyone does have an individual opinion.

I just think this is the first time I've the more belligerent wokesters, who would both agree that nasty feminists who say no to any man at all, however he sees himself, are 'terfs', openly having very different responses to an Anti-Woman action, for their different reasons.

" Any comment on the odd conflict of aims among the Trans Enby activists"

I view them as individual comments? Different people are going to have different views of course.

Apologies I’m in two threads and getting mixed up!

Autumn yes sorry I meant The Stage tweeted an apology. Not OV.

Yes, Autumn, you're quite right, it was The Stage, not the OV. Any comment on the odd conflict of aims among the Trans Enby activists, which aside from my lack of concentration was the point of my post?

Maybe if women just wandered on crying ‘oooh its a willy’ and the classic cry (in response to a flasher) of ‘ooooo it looks like a penis - but much smaller’

I am go to the theatre several times a month and often to the old vic. I will not go to theatres who have mixed toilets because men make a mess.

Humber was that to me?

The Stage have tweeted an apology. The Old Vic don't seem to be "grovelling" about anything. The last comment I can find is the non-statement from last week?

They’ve tweeted an apology for commissioning two articles. They felt they wanted to show both ‘sides’ of the debate.

That have now said it was a mistake and they are so sorry to have stirred up such a sensitive subject.

In other words they’ve given in to the bullies. And we know which commissioned piece got them frothing. Cowards.

Non binary and transgender aims and agendas are fundamentally contradictory at heart.

BeMoreMagdalen

I'm confused because I can't find any sign of the Old Vic grovelling?

So, I was reading through the thread under the OVs grovelling, and I'm a little confused. There are obviously feminists pulling for single sex provision. But there are also people demanding no gender neutral loos who are also throwing TERF round as an insult. So I'm seeing a split between Enby activists who love the mixed sex loos, and Trans activists who are angry about losing the validation involved in being in a toilet designated for the female sex. Seriously, these people have such trouble finding a coherent argument, I doubt they could find their arse with both hands.

Is it half term already?

Just seen the grovelling apology made by OV. Probably due to the massive TRA pile on. Idiots.

Funny how an article calling for consideration to everyone gets TRA’s immediately calling people nasty names and hurling insults about being anti-trans. very selfish and self centred behaviour on show for all to see.

Sarah Ditum:

"Just spent twenty minutes on the phone angrily telling the features ed - who approached me, commissioned me, and to whom I made myself available for any rewrites all for a derisory 50 quid fee (important enough issue to take a hit on the rate, I thought) - that he's a coward"

twitter.com/sarahditum/status/1181213886151892992?s=19

"Unbelievable as it seems, the issue of whether women should have toilets is incendiary. I agreed to write for the Stage in good faith, believing they intended to give a platform to an important conversation. That was my mistake and god do I regret it."

"You can read the column here, on my website, and decide for yourself whether @TheStage was right to pull it without even forewarning me t.co/zacpsltCJQ "

"Btw I've donated my fee to @nia_endingVAWG, who do incredible work"

Haha I meant single sex! Doh.

I don't know if anyone has already commented, but I'm pleased to report that there are plenty of mixed sex toilets at the Royal Albert Hall. Wokeness hasn't reached this far into Kensington.

Well in theory. Lets be honest, in practice it's more often heads people born with penises win, tails people born with XX chromosomes lose. Double standards are no problem throughout most of the Woke agenda.

However I'm very definitely up for not enabling the unisex experience to be more comfortable for men than women, particularly on behalf of the women with faith/disability/trauma/culture who have been excluded completely in a situation which identifies as inclusive, and lacks passing privilege.

If the urinal containing toilets reverted to single gender, then I think a great many genderfree women might feel they had a right to choose. That is how it works after all.