SURROGACY CONSULTATION ENDS ON FRIDAY 11 OCTOBER - PLEASE SUBMIT A RESPONSE [Edited by MNHQ at OP's request]

That's a good point littlecabbage
Sorry I didn't think to put something along those lines in my response.

That is really awful.

One of the many things that gets to me about surrogacy, is that a surrogate will either be a first time mother, and therefore has no concept of what she has agreed to give away. Or she will already have children, and is risking leaving them as orphans by undertaking another pregnancy. Yes, women risk this to add to their own family, but I think the risk is far less justified to have a surrogate baby.

I hadn't seen this before. Death of a surrogate in the UK.

www.bionews.org.uk/page_89547

Well done @littlecabbage
It does take a long time doing the whole thing, or even mixing in one's own answers with some copied in from NMN. But it's so important.

Thank you for making me aware of this dreadful proposed law. I have started the consultation. It is taking a little while despite the useful advice above, because I am keen to personalise my answers, but for anyone who wishes to object but has very little time, please see above for much quicker ways to submit objections.

I will ensure my responses are submitted before the deadline.

A long and very informative academic paper on international surrogacy. It sickens me that the UK lawyers want to smooth the path for commissioning parents who choose to do this.
Another problem is that in countries that ban surrogacy such as France and Switzerland when parents return with a baby and present a "done deal", rather than prosecute them, the law courts tend to decide that the best interests of the child are served by legalising the parental relationship.
There really need to be painful consequences for people who do this. IMO they should be prosecuted for human trafficking and even if the norm is a suspended sentence, they still get a criminal conviction for people trafficking on their record. Maybe setting a precedent like that would change behaviour. There has to be a real disincentive to stop this.

www.dovepress.com/current-perspectives-on-the-ethics-of-selling-international-surrogacy--peer-reviewed-fulltext-article-MB

She's interviewed by Dustin Lance Black here, about ten minutes in.

www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/p06vdfwb

He isn't remotely concerned about her doing it so many times.

The NHS has to manage these high risk pregnancies.

In the news, a 52 year old UK woman, a self described ‘commercial surrogate’, says she is to go for a 14th baby as a result of what she says is a ‘compulsion’, with an IVF embryo to be transferred in a private clinic and the baby to be born in a UK NHS hospital.

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7539757/Surrogate-mum-14th-time-52-admits-pregnancy-compulsion.html

In this previous article she says she is stopping doing surrogacy, talks about why she started it at the age of 27, how her family reacted, and talks about how she and her male partner allowed their own baby to be adopted by the intended parents after a surrogacy plan went wrong. The sperm donation from the intended father didn’t work and the pregnancy was from her partner, DNA tests on the baby revealed.

www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-2229021/Carole-Horlock-Why-giving-away-13-babies-Britains-prolific-surrogate-finally-quitting.html

Another previous article about her includes some reaction to her, including an unpleasant and revealing comment showing how surrogates can be seen as commodities, that she is ‘past her sell-by date’:

www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-6497693/Im-trying-sweet-16-Surrogate-mother-52-vows-baby-number-15-not-last.html

@howonearthdidwegethere OP do you want to ask MumsnetHQ to change the title to reflect the final week counting down? Or the closing date October 11 ?

Well done YesDearNoDear I feel mine wasn't ranty enough!

Also a reminder that the UK Consultation on surrogacy law has one week to go. You can use Nordic Model Now ten minute download to respond.

https://nordicmodelnow.org/2019/08/30/how-to-respond-to-the-uk-surrogacy-consultation-in-10-easy-minutes/

Or just scroll through and answer a few questions.

42 Proposals to lift the ban on advertising.Yes uni women will be targeted for their eggs or to be surrogate mothers.

65 Minimum age of 18 for a surrogate (and also 64 minimum age 18 for commissioning parent of surrogate baby. Who would be funding this I ask?) Do you have a teenage daughter? Ask her what she thinks about becoming a surrogate mother at 18. My daughter thinks young women that age should be planning careers and going to university. And also that they are still young enough to deserve protection from adults who may seek to exploit or coerce them.

71 No maximum number of surrogate pregnancies a woman can undertake. Even dogs have more protection in law in the UK. Licensed dog breeders limited to six litters from a bitch and the Kennel club won't register puppies after four litters.

79 Compensation for pain and inconvenience of childbirth and complications.

80 How should a surrogate mother's family be compensated should she die as a result of the pregnancy. What price a woman's life?

94,95 are concerned with easing the way to bring a baby home from abroad for surrogacy tourists.
At a time when countries like India, Thailand and Cambodia have had to ban surrogacy to protect the populace from abuses and exploitation by rich westerners seeking uteruses for hire it is shameful that this country should be seeking to make it easier.
Imo anyone returning from abroad with a baby should be prosecuted for people trafficking.

107 Finally gets round to considering if there are any issues for the health service. 

118 is basically any other business.

I haven't mentioned earlier questions which are key proposals, which seek to change the way Commissioning parents acquire legal parenthood. Check out the Nordic Model Now answers to get more understanding of these proposals.

I had a bit of a rant about how the phrase 'intended parents' was just a euphemism, and really they should just be called buyers. A very polite rant of course.

I've also sent the consultation to SIL and DM. With the self id one DM was so outraged that she rounded up about 20 very unwoke relatives to also complete, and I expect the same with this one.

It doesn't ask that question TheBullshitGiesOn

It is a very inaccessible document with its 118 questions.

Just answer a few key ones and send an email answer.

Thanks for the links. I was trying to fill it in earlier, but couldn't find the appropriate place to write 'selling a human is wrong. Commercial surrogacy should not be permitted in this country (or any country'.

Bump.

I submitted mine yesterday using the Nordic Model now template. Bumping this thread.

The Law Commission met with the Dept of Ed and I can't see the connection to surrogacy

Yes why did they meet with the department of education? I would think I was letting my imagination run away with me to suggest it has anything to do with the proposed minimum age of 18 but these days real life is bounding way ahead of my imagination in so many areas, so I am left wondering WHY?

That's interesting 2Rebecca I have heard of similar but I haven't been involved or around adoption to know that much about it.

I think a child that already exists and needs a loving home should prioritised (not the right word I realise) before a new life is created. I understand that need of wanting a child in your own image but I think this should be challenged and more should be done to help those who want to adopt and to adopt older children. The issue of children being affected by their parents substance abuse is more of a reason to invest time and money into helping them. I also think the assessment that adopting parents need to go through is thorough for a reason and childless couples should be encouraged into this route, rather than building families through surrogacy that involves all kinds of hoop jumping...mostly from women.

The Law Commission met with the Dept of Ed and I can't see the connection to surrogacy, it makes me suspicious of the steps that follow this consultation, will university students be approached for their eggs or sperm.

It's great to see so many people saying they've done it. I wish I had kept a note each time I saw a ✅ so I could tot up the numbers because there's quite few on the various threads in Mumsnet plus more on Twitter and spinster which is quite heartening.

Especially as it is a nightmare to complete even with help from the NMN download. It took me several hours on Saturday.

It's so frustrating that thanks to Brexit it feels as if every day for the last three years has been a good day to bury bad news. I want to write to various MPs and the Health minister but it feels like they just won't bother about this with everything else going on. The

Sent, using the Nordic Model Now word doc version. Will be complaining tomorrow!

The trouble with adoption is that very few tiny babies come up for adoption. Social services often see adoption as a last resort so many kids have attachment and behaviour issues by the time they come up for adoption that may not be reversible. Also their brains may have been damaged by their parents' substance abuse. Patients and friends I know who have adopted have had a lot of problems with children with attachment issues.
The kids being adopted now are different to those being adopted in the 1950s.
I think long term fostering can be better for all concerned as the expectations and emotional intensity are more relaxed then.

I found the same 2Rebecca - it was a relief to send it. Now the complaint letter!

My thoughts about having a truly altruistic surrogacy arrangement with a family member is that this is not without potential issues either. What if they suffer great pain or complications during the birth, or even if they have terrible birth injuries that require long term treatment, or suffer fertility issues after giving birth for their sibling or cousin.

If my best mate donated an egg not only would I always see her in my child but if they got breast cancer or ovarian cancer I would feel so guilty and responsible.

If my sister had a child for me then never could have one for herself the damage caused to our relationship would be unimaginable, and if the most terrible thing happen it could split a family forever.

All this could happen without the question of cash for babies so it's just so complex and risky for me, I can't understand why more don't adopt.

Finished it today. It took a while, even with copying and pasting many of the Nordic Model Now responses.
It made me both angry and unhappy.
Surrogacy benefits neither women nor the children conceived that way.
I can understand a woman being a surrogate for a wombless sister but the risks are so great that women shouldn't be doing it for unknown couples or as their "job".

God, sometimes I wish I'd never ever visited this board and could be in blissful denial about how totally fucked up the world is. I used to think that surrogacy was a lovely notion before I had babies. I'll do a response today, thanks for the links

The more I look into surrogacy the more I see there are dark forces of men's rights and big business pushing for this.
At one of the consultations I went to there was a (presumably het) couple of hopeful parents. The aggressive level of entitlement from the man was extraordinary as he argued against my complaints that 18 was too young to be a surrogate, my concern about the woman Dustin Lance Black interviewed who had had 13 surrogate babies (women can do that naturally so what's the problem?) and more.

This really isn't about sisters and best friends doing a wonderful thing for each other. That is just the Trojan horse.

Just to say, this really is worth doing. I was shocked by what the consultation reveals. Basically, the approach is that women’s bodies, and the children born from them, are commodities. I can’t understand how these proposals could possibly be put forward in good faith.

You can do a page at a time and save it.