Civility, reasonableness, and those rules

Tell me to fuck off if you want to, explain to me why I am wrong. Don't just go running to HQ to get me deleted.

Oh good, I am not allowed to talk about what I said that got another message deleted! I am really interested to know who is reporting me, no names were mentioned and I suggested possible robust replies they could have made.

Oh, Lass is gone? I disagreed with her on about 70% of stuff but she had the nerve and moral compass to speak her mind. Pity she jumped/ was pushed/same thing.

I'm not familiar with exactly what is allowed under the posting rules- are they the same rules as Mornington Crescent?

Why does every post have to be "constructive"? One must first deconstruct the patriarchy before one builds something new in its place. Or is this board not meant to be for that kind of feminism?

I can mock the Prime Minister on this website. I can call him selfserving, a cheat, a liar and a misogynist. I can call him arrogant, disrespectful and controlling. I can mock the fact that he changed the name he was known by to suit his own manufactured brand and selfserving ends and downplays the names on his birth cert that don't suit his agenda. On the Feminist and Women's Rights board (or NonMeninist Nonthreatening Chinwag board or whatever they want it to be now) am I allowed to do the same to a horrible male who has indicated his glee at the death of a feminist?

Since I'm probably going to get banned at some stage anyway, as I really cannot be arsed to keep up with the latest iteration of the Mornington Crescent rules:

Going by his recent internet activity, that man Rhys McKinnon really is a nasty misogynist piece of work, isn't he?

Having not read the original post I can't get the full picture, but I can see how some would see comparisons of trans people to Widow Twanky almost being offensive in a gollywog type of way.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA.

Own goal alert!

Having not read the original post I can't get the full picture, but I can see how some would see comparisons of trans people to Widow Twanky almost being offensive in a gollywog type of way.

So a man impersonating a woman is offensive to who? Women surely?

Appropriating / apeing / caricaturing womanhood and appropriating / apeing / caricaturing race. Yes, there is a lot to compare there. Obviously both are very bad.

Just popping in to say I initially misread LangClegs post, bottom of page 2, about devilish SWERFish as a type of fish.

I will now cook myself SWERFish and TERFish on a regular basis. It’s my new favourite food, in spite of MNHQs random rules.

Having not read the original post I can't get the full picture, but I can see how some would see comparisons of trans people to Widow Twanky almost being offensive in a gollywog type of way.

Sorted, thanks 51testing987654321

I want the truth to be sayable again.

This. Many times over.

On a side note Barracker - Posie Parker wanted to get in touch with you, in case the message hadn't already been passed to you.

If Mumsnet could just tell me the acceptable, courteous, constructive way to call a man, a man, I would gladly use it.

But their position seems to be that we may not speak of what is patently true. In any way. We are disallowed and consequences will be meted out to those who do speak of the truth, no matter how neutrally, courteously, or deferentially they try to say it.

And as I type that I can't believe I'm in the UK and it's 2019. That women are punished for stating fact. And a huge influential forum called Mumsnet has decided this is a good thing.

I have loved Mumsnet, and I still think it has influence. But making truth a punishable offence is a horrifying state of affairs. And I wish MNHQ could just take a moment to realise what they are doing to that Overton window.

As far as I'm concerned, it's an Ovary window, and I'm shoving it back in the other direction as hard as I can, alongside thousands of other women.

Be the change you want to see.
I want the truth to be sayable again.

Telling women off for being against the exploitation of women on a feminist forum on a parenting site. Do you even hear yourselves, MN?

Very well said. I just play about on AIBU these days and am getting more and more bored with MN. I stay for FWR and the politics threads. Everything else here is pointless and ephemeral; passes the time.

MNHQ, I used to respect you but I suppose Carrie and Justine had a tighter hold on the reins. I cry "shame" at you (I know you couldn't give a shit).

Another thought: a lot of women on here have said they don't believe in gender and are genderfree, so technically they're trans. Which would make MNHQ messages to such women which say they're being 'rude' and 'aggressive' for making jokes quite 'rude' to trans people right?

Oh wait, I forgot it doesn't matter if anyone's rude to people who are XX and trans, it's only the men. Silly me.

It is weird that MNHQ go along with the outside reporters who are men who hate women because these outside reporters would like nothing more than the whole of MN to shut down because they simply don't like large numbers of women talking.

Also, why aren't pantomime dames actual transpeople? Under the stonewall definition they are. What's the difference between a pantomime dame and Pips Bunce who is only a woman part-time? I don't see what's rude about comparing them, I honestly categorically cannot see the difference, to me they seem entirely the same. How on earth are we supposed to differentiate?

and so the forum loses the voices of women who are legally trained, or safeguarding experts, or who have lived through enough abuse to be able to warn us of techniques like gaslighting and pronouns being a word we're not allowed to say.

Yes, these are the ones the outside reporters are targeting. The ones who really have the skills to help other women overcome abuse of all kinds, to assert boundaries, and help them understand safeguarding so they can protect their kids. Lisa Muggeridge being banned is an example, there are many more (Offred springs to mind). And that is why I stay, because there are women struggling out there and this is one of the places where they can find help from other women.

You know, at some point TRAs are going to insist that the name of the site is itself transphobic.

I mean, midwives are now being made to stop using the word “mother” and NHS staff have been instructed to stop using it.

Males are now claiming they too are mothers, while females who’ve given birth are insisting they are NOT mothers.

So how can Mum be allowed to stand?

At what point will this site be made to rename itself Gestators.net?

That IS the future facing this site if women will not stop ceding language and actual physical ground to male insistence that women “be nice.”

Love it when someone who isn't a regular poster, and who is clearly delighted that women's rights are under threat, tells all the feminists who are angry about coercive control dressed up as moderation that they should leave the forum to all the people who don't bother posting about women's rights or any of that shit. Yeah, MNHQ, observe the long queue of misogynistists just waiting to fill FWR with fabulous content to really make your brand distinctively shine.

If I hadn't loved this place at one point I wouldn't be so disappointed in what's happened to it. I suspect that's the case for many.

I wholeheartedly agree Kittens

Why should feminists give up yet another space to appease the TRAs and their flying monkeys?

Women being told to post nicely is like women being told to smile. It's not our job to smile just to make other people feel better.

Why are women expected to post nicely against the tactics of the opposing side?

No point in turning up to a weaponised debate with fluff.

I don't hate this place exWifebeginsAgainat46, I bloody love it.

It's unique on the internet as far as I know. The only place where women's voices dominate

I have been reading the FWR board for a while and its become very clear that the rules around what we can and cannot say are changed on the spur of the moment and are not applied consistently. The fact that people are now getting emails about deleted posts that don't even reference the thread the post was or give a clear reason why its being deleted is disturbing. Its in breach of the rules is not clear unless you state which rule and why the pose breached it.
The fact that these rules only seem to apply to FWR and not the rest of the boards is even more disturbing.
Lets not even get on to the fact that Mumsnet HQ now allow targeted harassment of well know posters by allowing reporting from outside the site (through twitter) and within the site without proper investigation.
Mumsnet HQ you need to ask yourself some serious questions about why this is allowed to continue

It’s also harder for women to post here, who use other boards for support or advice. You don’t want to risk getting summarily banned, as this would also cut you off from that source of support.

^^ This - I do end up self censoring and not posting here. It doesn't change my views reduce my concerns or stop me talking about this in RL.