Please or to access all these features

Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

What I've Learned About Toxic Masculinity As A Trans Man

65 replies

stumbledin · 12/09/2019 18:58

I read this article thinking it would be about how a woman who had decided to transition then found herself part of the patriarchy.

But in fact what it says to me is that young people are being educated to not know or acknowledge the reality of biological sex. And because of this are left trying to understand their reality and the impact of society's gender stereotyping while denying the underlying basis of sex / sexism.

Far from helping young people as they grow up and try to work out how to be comfortable with themselves, trasn activism and language is imposing an additional, and purely notional, social straightjacket that creates further disassociation.

The politics of identity, whose hazy concepts and doublespeak, is an obstacle race that many young people just dont need in their lives.

www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/toxic-masculinity_uk_5d78ed0fe4b09342507cb2cf?guccounter=1

OP posts:
zanahoria · 12/09/2019 21:54

not only does she define herself by stereotypes, she takes testosterone to back them up.

Voice0fReason · 12/09/2019 21:51

She doesn't like stereotypes but then defines herself using them. She reinforces them and their existence.

Non-binary transmasculine.
So not a stereotypical male but a woman who likes to present in a masculine way.
Why the hell can't she be a woman and present herself however the hell she wants?

AnyOldPrion · 12/09/2019 21:44

So the world becomes #YesAllMen, even when trans masculine people are at higher risk of experiencing sexual assault and have no provision made for them

So they is pretending not to be female, but the world goes right on treating them as the female they obviously is. But there’s no problem in the lovely warm transworld... They know it’s lovely there because they was told it, and when they first got there, they felt that warmth.... And now, if only they could find the right words, or the right way to appeal, they would find that warmth again....

CaptainKirksSpookyGhost · 12/09/2019 21:01

Why is the word “folk” not gender neutral enough?

I guess this includes Furry and Pup kin.

ibuiltahomeforyou · 12/09/2019 20:57

I agree @thirdfiddle, I don't like the word 'tomboy' either. My DD is only two and is getting called a 'tomboy' by nursery staff for liking blue 🙄

MrsTerryPratchett · 12/09/2019 20:56

That isn't about birth sex nor gender stereotypes though, it's about having rare interests and a shortage of like-minded people to bond with.

We called it being alternative. Goths, punks, hippies, nerds, rockers all welcome. Just no Sharons or Trevors. Grin

And no one had to chop anything off.

forkfun · 12/09/2019 20:32

@thirdfiddle very well said.

StrangeLookingParasite · 12/09/2019 20:18

I come back time and again to the idea of the gender tally. How do we collect enough points to ‘pass’ as being male?

But why even bother? Why give a toss about what gets called male? Or female?

thirdfiddle · 12/09/2019 20:08

I really don't like tomboy actually. When people called me that as a child I felt like I was being told I was doing girl wrong. How about just girl who's into ... whatever it is she's into. Geek would have described me quite well, though did like outdoorsy stuff and setting fire to things too. (Or does just "child" cover that one?)

bd67th · 12/09/2019 19:56

We already have a word for female-born people who don't act "girly": "tomboy". Why invent complicated multi-word labels like "non-binary transmasculine" when we have "tomboy"?

I totally get the feeling of not being like the other girls (e.g. interested in boy bands and makeup) but not wanting the boy stuff (e.g. watching football and sexually-harassing girls) either and being terribly isolated as a result of having nothing in common with anyone. That isn't about birth sex nor gender stereotypes though, it's about having rare interests and a shortage of like-minded people to bond with.

EL2019 · 12/09/2019 19:53

Tenth word in: Folx

Why is the word “folk” not gender neutral enough?

CaptainKirksSpookyGhost · 12/09/2019 19:42

Someone has been told since they were very small that gender is a thing, we are all assigned one and so on.

They are now slowly realizing it's total bollocks made up to oppress, and that everyone is different and has their own personality... but to go against the grain here means they were wrong, everything they've been told is wrong.

I would assume there are lots of people in the same position, but the only option given is constant positive affirmation that it's true, anything else is considered conversion therapy.

thirdfiddle · 12/09/2019 19:36

I'm seeing a young person discovering as many of us did in our teens that gender is narrowing and toxic and unnecessary - and then tying themselves in knots trying to express that without departing from woke-speak. They could be millimetres from realising the whole thing is bollocks.

Basically they're saying they don't feel male in the least, don't particular get on with males or identify with the males they know; but do possibly suffer body dysphoria. That's okay. It's okay to be a woman with dysphoria, if you can't find a way to live with your body it's okay as an adult to take hormones or have surgery as a last resort. It's tough medically, but it's okay. It's okay to follow some female stereotypes and some male stereotypes or switch from day to day. It's okay to use whatever name you like. It's okay to be yourself and be individual.

Seems like all these labels are actively hindering this young person in that. They're so close to seeing it though, I hope they get there soon. Particularly if they are considering surgery as that's a major and irreversible step and I would like to be sure they're doing it because of long term dysphoria and not just because it fits a label they are currently clinging to.

Birdsfoottrefoil · 12/09/2019 19:12

That is not the fault of an inability to write but rather an inability to think. If you are going to construct a carefully argued piece then you have to think through your argument - and therein lies the problem because by doing that the whole thing unravels

Datun · 12/09/2019 19:08

Oh dear lorddddd.

Is this female born individual trying to identify as a man without relying on the stereotypes they despise - and finding it a little tricky?

It's difficult to tell because what ever they have been told about writing, no one told them that it's meant to be able to communicate ideas effectively.