Trans Widows Escape Committee 3: Rise of the Trans Widows

Tyro it seems a familiar pattern; I had discussions about acceptable behaviour in the family home and got agreement; almost immediately broken. I could list the things I negotiated where boundaries were breached. So agree with Tinsel that the question for unhappy women in these relationships is not about what the man does, but what is tolerable... hence we welcome women who are immediate-runners like me, right through to women who are staying, out of guilt, feeling it models caring behaviour to children, financial/childcare/housing need, or who are staying and crossing their fingers that agreed boundaries will be respected. It's about what the woman feels is acceptable and fair; we all have our own limits.

What were the preliminary stages? I need to know so I can compare them to my life and feel alarmed.

I suspect a day is coming when I will have so many of these badges that I'll never be able to find a willing male sexual partner again. I just can't bring myself to see that as a downside any more.

I think ex intuitively understands that I would view step 6 as a declaration of war. As I'm the primary carer of his child, he does not want to risk that.

Really interesting list Tinsel.
My ex did weird stuff with our home desktop computer, installing different software for undetectable Googling. When he left I found it out including a weird USB stick. I'm not very tech-savvy but it felt such a betrayal.
For months I'd go into our spare room and hear the click of the mouse as he changed screen.
No guessing whether he had a former life in I.T....
Interestingly I've always felt (as did my furious ex in-laws) that I bailed at stage 0 on your list, but in fact I bailed at stage 6 which is what he announced with very little run-up.
So maybe I'm not such a terrible wife
We often get women on here wondering whether 'dressing' will just stay at 'dressing' which they can tolerate because of the kids etc. I count myself lucky to have bailed immediately, despite the trauma of it all.
I was lucky enough not to have to tolerate the misogyny of it all and I'm yet another spouse who wore Doc Martens and put out the bins. It's very weird...

Crossposted with you, Phantom.

Ex freely admits it's a sex thing too. It saddens me that one day we're going to have enough raw data to be able to say for certain whether openly admitting that it's a fetish acts as a prophylactic against flipping into a Stunning and Brave mentality. But I think it will turn out to be a factor.

I couldn't live with it forever even as just a sex thing though. Because he was honest about its roots and development. And when you know someone's in the habit of wanking over the association between sexualised performance of femininity and humiliation/degradation... it's kind of hard to see them in the same way. And it's very very hard to feel like you're an equal and respected partner instead of a prop.

Agreed. Why don't we teach children this? Everyone should know it before they're considered ready for the adult world.

'How I want to live my life' most emphatically does not involve lying back and submitting to any shit these days. 'What I want to do with my life' is a much harder question, but 'live it with integrity' is definitely in there.

So yesterday I had a short, honest chat with the ex about boundary pushing.

I started off by telling him "Remember when you said you like X? You need to know that simply raising the possibility of X functions to create pressure in my mind."

He had not realised this. And why would he? So few people have any real clue of the effects trauma has.

I asked him if he remembered what I'd said afterwards. "That you were okay with it as an occasional thing?" he said. Um, no. "I said it didn't do anything for me at all. It wasn't possible for me to be any more explicit at the time, but this was the clearest indication I could give you that I didn't like it and didn't want to do it. I was actually quite badly triggered by it, and trying to hide that from you was quite the headfuck. And then you did it again. Twice."

He apologised, said he hadn't realised - and yes, I believe his apology is sincere and he truly didn't realise. But what sort of a world raises men to not be able to interpret "Yeah, not massively keen on this, didn't do anything for me" as a green light to do it again? And how the hell do they get to the point of thinking a sex act is okay when their partner is getting nothing out of it? It's reducing the partner to a prop.

And then he said it won't happen again.

"No, it won't. Because you'll never be in a position to do it again, because I cannot take that chance. But I'm telling you this anyway so that, in future, you cannot use ignorance as a defence to minimise and excuse a lack of consideration and empathy."

I feel better for having said it, though doubtless many would tell me he's a lost cause and there's no point. There's a point for any future partners of his, though. For their sake he needs to know that women are conditioned in so many ways to not be able to give a clear and explicit no.

And it's got me a step further down the path of understanding that trying to like a particular act while ignoring that it's triggering is a Very Bad Idea, because while you can train yourself to tolerate and find some enjoyment in the act, it's still going to be triggering, and the cognitive dissonance isn't worth it.

Which translates to: I'll never suck a dick again. That's my boundary and I'm owning it and sticking to it and fuck anyone who says it's prudish or weird.

That was quite cathartic.

Actually he went through all, hotels the lot! He's found he doesn't want that-he doesn't want validation. It's a sex thing, a relaxing thing. It has been a bit of a strife, well through his mid life anyway. He knows it's going to be with him for ever, he knows he caused me pain. He hates that. However our marriage is strong. His dressing is non existant/low key.

I think that's one of the hardest things, that they mean it.

There's a thread in Relationships at the moment, a young woman's head's all over the place because her boyfriend violated the terms of her consent but he says and she believes he didn't mean it. My heart's breaking for her; she's got such a long and painful path ahead of her working this shit out.

It goes back to that illusion of male rationality and objectivity I think. They mean it on a conscious intellectual level at the time. They honestly believe they mean it. There's no deliberate, conscious malice. And yet their behaviour is repeatedly abusive, because they think their rational thoughts are more important than the reality of their actions in the real world.

And you can tie it to trans shit too. It doesn't matter what words are in someone's head, whether their intentions are benign - if their behaviour is experienced as abusive or damaging it cannot, must not, be excused and handwaved away on the grounds of words in their heads that no one else can see or hear or verify.

Makes me sceptical too. I mentioned a few weeks ago that ex said he was making a conscious effort to rein in his fetish - I believe he meant it; but that doesn't mean he's going to succeed, does it? And the statistical likelihood is that he may have some initial success but it won't last.

I'm doing the face again.

1 - Did you get regular weekends away to chill out and indulge your hobbies too?
2 - Working and wanking aren't supposed to happen at the same time...
3 - Oooh, that's dangerous - speaking from experience, fucking off to another city is a great opportunity to develop the confidence to go out in a new style because you're surrounded by strangers. (This is how I got comfortable wearing strappy tops and displaying my upper arms in public.)
4 - He was doing everything he could to encourage himself to sink into it further, wasn't he?
5 - I'm not even going to comment on what Pride's turned into.
6 - Thank fuck you bailed at this point.

For all the shit you went through, though, know this - it has helped other women to avoid the same. You've managed to turn a horrendous ongoing experience into making a real difference to other women's lives. Have some more .

Ah, see, I found the answer to that 'need more space' stage.

He can spend all the time he likes dressed up in his own home, because his home and my home are two completely separate buildings a mile apart.

An extreme solution perhaps, but the only viable option if my long-term mental health is a consideration.

Sounds like he's whingeing because he doesn't get to wank to his own highly specialised specifications.

That made me laugh Toxicity!! I must say our life is a lot better than it used to be, when he hit 50 and it climaxed (pardon the pun)as all this has calmed down a lot. I suppose he needs 'expression' sometime- fair enough, but I don't want to hear about it. He knows he's AGP, not in denial at all. Thank God he doesn't do the online sex talk with strangers anymore; I put my foot down (if he did , his guilt trip would be too great and he knows his life would be insufferable for a while-from me!).

How much time and space does he need?!

Sounds like he's whingeing because he doesn't get to wank to his own highly specialised specifications. Not a very attractive prospect; I don't blame you for struggling to fancy him afterwards, Phantom.

Is spending bloody ages at it a Thing for them? Ex can spend all day working up to the actual orgasm while dressed up and fantasising. I don't get it at all. You want an orgasm, just get on and have one, it's not bloody difficult!