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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Rachel McKinnon in the UK in October to lecture us on TW in sport!

113 replies

CloudRusting · 13/08/2019 10:03

Hmm

www.howtoacademy.com/events/transgender-athletes-and-the-science-of-fairness/?mc_cid=ad77a2171a&mc_eid=0ff868ffb0

From the listing:

Should trans athletes participate in women’s sport? Philosophy professor, activist and world champion cyclist Rachel McKinnon sifts science and ethics from politics and prejudice.

An issue with profound consequences for society’s ideas of fairness, gender, and equality, the participation of trans women in women’s competitive sports has made regular front page news.

Dr. Rachel McKinnon is at the forefront. As the first openly trans woman to win a world championship in an Olympic sport, she faces constant harassment and abuse on social media, while as an activist and public intellectual, her campaigns, papers, articles and interviews have done much to shift attitudes in the world of international sport and beyond.

In this talk, Dr. McKinnon will explore the ethics, law and science of fairness in sport, including whether biological restrictions such as testosterone limits violate principles of fairness and equality. Ahead of this autumn’s track racing world championship in Manchester, don’t miss this opportunity to hear from an internationally renowned athlete and scholar on how she is breaking down barriers and helping to overturn prejudice with science.

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CharlieParley · 19/08/2019 00:38

I read the damn thing. It's even more stupid than the title suggests. Complete shite. Honestly surprised anyone got awarded a PhD for that. Made me reconsider my rejection of the Micky Mouse degree narrative. And then I saw all the articles about the Grievance Study affair and it all made sense.

frazzled1 · 19/08/2019 00:19

McKinnon's thesis title: Reasonable Assertions: On Norms of Assertion and Why You Don't Need to Know What You're Talking About comes to mind when you think this person (obvious male puberty) claims to belong in XX sport.

Rachel McKinnon in the UK in October to lecture us on TW in sport!
CharlieParley · 19/08/2019 00:00

As an aside, I imagine a grease fire is meant to be even worse than a common or garden conflagration?

Yes. Grease fires happen when your oil gets too hot and starts to burn. Can't be extinguished with water, spreads incredibly quickly. If you get any on your body it leads to horrific injuries because it keeps on burning at an incredible temperature. Think chip pan fire.

Also common in commercial kitchens that don't follow proper safety protocols. Their powerful extractor fans suck out the cooking fumes, including tiny particles of grease. These tiny particles stick to the extractor grille and the vents, any build-up of grease here is incredibly dangerous. Fires can break out both while the kitchen is working and overnight, with devastating consequences. That's why extractor and vents have to be cleaned regularly and kitchens can be fined for not doing so.

So yeah, McKinnon being oddly specific here but certainly not randomly.

Datun · 18/08/2019 23:31

I make it work. It's not hard.

I'd venture to suggest that's a contradiction in terms, for a start. grin]

Lordamighty · 18/08/2019 21:09

Singling out that should say.

Lordamighty · 18/08/2019 21:08

Singling our “genital preferences” is transphobic.

Not from McK but another Twitter user. These people are completely & utterly deluded. I’m not sure that some of them are completely sane after reading that.

TemporaryPermanent · 18/08/2019 18:00

Oh God Dr McK is SO HORRIBLE. Just as a personality. Need to stop looking at links of their unpleasant, brutish opinions.

GirlDownUnder · 18/08/2019 17:22

GeorgeFayne

Some new (disturbing?) quotes for you

mobile.twitter.com/rachelvmckinnon/status/1162859815552659457
“Still disagree, bit time. Genital 'preferences' aren't fixed, and are massively socially influenced.
I fall for people...and whatever their genitals happen to look like, I make it work. It's not hard.”

mobile.twitter.com/rachelvmckinnon/status/1162760536863465472
“Nah. People only shy away from new experiences because of stigma. PiV is boring as fuck anyway.”

mobile.twitter.com/rachelvmckinnon/status/1162774306461573122
“That we can't control what kinds of sex are arousing.”

So, it’s all ‘social’, nothing to see here, and you should ‘just try harder’

Shock
LordProfFekkoThePenguinPhD · 18/08/2019 15:57

‘I may not know who but certainly know what’ (I would’ve said inbetween fits of giggles)

EdithSitwell · 18/08/2019 15:39

Their tweet to Martina Navratilova when she said something like "I don't think you realise who you're talking to....." still makes me giggle. Delusions of grandeur, indeed.

Michelleoftheresistance · 18/08/2019 10:06

We don’t do that, because we’re not MRAs/TRAs. We actually believe in the right to free speech

Here here.

Two reasons being: I may not agree with what you say but I will defend your right to say it freely without intimidation because I'm not a totalitarian nut job, and any highly controversial line of thought significantly damaging to the interests of 50% of the population needs to be talked about as much as possible, as openly as possible, and the key ideas laid out for national debate and scrutiny.

So crack on Rache. I'll hold your coat.

LordProfFekkoThePenguinPhD · 18/08/2019 08:12

No. Let them come. I’m all for free speech - especially if it shines a light on people, their thoughts and motives.

MangoesAreMyFavourite · 18/08/2019 08:09

Ooooh! That's just mean!!

Well, here's hoping BA is on strike and all baggage lands in Australia .
Also, much rain and general greyness...

GeorgeFayne · 18/08/2019 07:37

This American hopes RMcK gets detained for some reason, and you'll just have to keep RMcK in the UK!

GeorgeFayne · 18/08/2019 07:33

Or there was the gem about lesbians learning to get over their genital hang-ups, in which RMcK said, "Sometimes happens. Other times, the cis lesbian gets over her genital hangups and realizes that she can cope just fine."

GeorgeFayne · 18/08/2019 07:30

Remember the RMcK tweet about Pap smears, (in response to the idea that a woman should be able to request a female provider)? "Is the penis doing the pap smear? No? Then STFU transphobe."

TemporaryPermanent · 18/08/2019 06:24

Ive realised my post suggests that i think if Dr McK was speaking well and giving interesting and challenging information, that i then think the venue should be harassed and Dr McK be stopped from speaking!! Not the case. I think those actions ate wrong in any case.

bettybeans · 17/08/2019 23:03

RMcK doesn't come across well. Not a naturally gifted speaker. Aggressive, petulant and thoroughly unlikeable. Self-aggrandising. Let RMcK peak a few more people if that's what RMcK wants to do.

The thing RMcK hates even more than "transphobes" is being ignored.

LordProfFekkoThePenguinPhD · 17/08/2019 22:46

The general managers name of the venue is Mr Perillous?

No I won’t be going.

FannyCann · 17/08/2019 22:43

That's the funny thing Temporary

Tras protest women's meetings because they know that logical common sense will be spoken , spreading the word.

Women don't protest talks by the likes of McKinnon because they know that such nonsense will be spoken, awareness will be spread: let the peak trans Sherpa do their work.

GrinGrinGrin

TemporaryPermanent · 17/08/2019 21:47

I definitely don't think the venue hosting Dr McKinnon should be pursued for hosting this talk, nor should there be protests. Dr McK has done more for women's rights than many of us, by writing meretricious claptrap, by promoting pictures of themselves as a legit champion, thereby showing that recent sports rule changes are insane, and in particular by displaying an enormous ego and deranged opinions in exchanges with Martina Navratilova. Rachel and Jessica are the tide turners. Let Dr McK speak freely, as often and as loudly as possible.

andyoldlabour · 17/08/2019 10:29

chockaholic72

Arnaud Duble, the winner of the men's sprint at last year's masters, was an ex pro for Cofidis on the road, won a junior World Championship on the track in 1998, won a World Championship gold medal in the team sprint at the World Championship 2001 and was a World record holder at 500m.

mastersworlds2018.veloresults.com/pdf/221M35spfc.pdf

firstcycling.com/rider.php?r=11690

Kieran Leahy, ex Irish pro cyclist and record holder.

www.stickybottle.com/latest-news/world-track-record-mexico-kieran-leahy/

I have been through the lists/results and there are quite a few ex pros and olympic riders at the masters.

andyoldlabour · 17/08/2019 09:56

chockaholic72

"That’s why McKinnon’s victory blew up: It was the first time a trans woman won a world championship in any sport, ever,"

www.bicycling.com/culture/a25736012/transgender-world-champion-track-cycling-race/

"Rachel McKinnon has entered the history books as the first transgender woman to win a cycling world title."

www.cyclingweekly.com/news/latest-news/rachel-mckinnon-becomes-first-transgender-woman-win-track-world-title-397473

The problem is that the press very often print things which are obviously untrue. People then repeat those untruths to further promote agendas, which is how we end up with the rdiculous, narcissistic McKinnon sperging lie after lie.

chockaholic72 · 16/08/2019 23:42

@andyoldlabour - you're almost right, Michelle was a world Masters champ. But, MTB Downhill (which you couldn't pay me to do because it's so scary!) isn't an Olympic sport - some MTb events are, but not Downhill. So, RMcK is right in that she's the first Masters WC in an Olympic cycling discipline - track sprint.

Further to my previous post, Petra Wiltshire was a pro who then rode in the Masters, but pros in cycling Masters events, (in the UK at least) are very few and far between.

chockaholic72 · 16/08/2019 23:33

@herefortheduration - sorry for any confusion, it isn't a personal opinion, just how it tends to be in cycling, and no offence was intended. Once retired, most pros (if they've made any money) will tend to try and get their life back as training and competing tends to be all-encompassing, or, they'll go into coaching, or they'll ride things like the Tour d'Etape or high profile sportives, as sometimes they are paid well for special appearances. Some will go into commentary, some will do sports science degrees and go back into the system that way. Off the top of my head I can't think of a single former professional who rides Masters cycling events. Might be quite interesting - Rachel Mc versus Vicky Pendleton ☺️

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