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Original poster

How to talk to super-woke family?

66 replies

Ritascornershop · 02/08/2019 02:28

My youngest has been away at college and has recently returned. He has an older sister who is gender critical: he is very left wing on all issues, imo doesn’t try to see other sides in issues, and takes things very personally. Like a lot of people his age.

I’ve found we disagree on politics only when it comes to issues affecting women. He believes the burka to be non-oppressive/ I disagree. He believed men got the short end when it came to custody (got that idea from his dad/my exh)/ I did get him to look at links that showed that in our country the default is 50-50 custody so he backed off on that. He believes that trans people have gender dysphoria, but also that they are terribly oppressed, at serious risk in the US of “being rounded up and murdered by the state”, should be allowed in women’s spaces etc.

I’d really rather not argue about it as my wonderful facts have never persuaded anyone of anything. So from now on I guess I’m just saying “hmmm”? I cannot stand confrontation. Can’t stand it. But of course a (young) man storming out of the room when I disagree with him (right now he’s stormed off for a walk) cannot help but feel oppressive. As if I’m not allowed to have a different opinion than him. To be fair, he’s probably like this if his dad offers a different opinion too - his abhorrence I’d different opinions is not restricted to women who disagree, but I do think he’s very unaware of how it comes across when disagreeing with a woman (his mum).

This is my kid and he has so many wonderful qualities!! And I figure in time he’ll mellow. But aside from annoying the fuck out of me, I worry he’ll be somewhat intolerable to other people with this “how dare you not be as woke as me!” attitude.

When I was his age, in the 80’s, I had relatives who were Thatcherites and I was flummoxed by their stupidity, but did zero flouncing out of rooms.

Anyone have words of wisdom for weathering this stage? It’s the only thing we ever disagree on!

OP posts:
Original poster
Ritascornershop · 02/08/2019 03:16

He’s grown up seeing women in charge at school, me having women supervisors more often than men, women having lots of theoretical rights ... I suspect he thinks the struggle is mostly won.

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HostofDaffodils · 02/08/2019 03:16

Perhaps he should look at incidents of rape and sexual harassment at university?

coolwalking · 02/08/2019 03:13

Yes I think you've hit the nail on the head. The women he's around at college are most likely not oppressed as they speak their beliefs freely.

Original poster
Ritascornershop · 02/08/2019 03:09

I like that Eileen!! He loves Python so that might work.

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Original poster
Ritascornershop · 02/08/2019 03:05

I like that Cool. I do feel his heart is in the right place, he wants to support the oppressed. He’s just got the idea that women are no longer oppressed. But you’re right, a blunt reminder of who has a stake in these issues.

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EileenAlanna · 02/08/2019 03:03

Just answer any of the iffy things he says with "Don't you oppress me with that patriarchal misogyny" & flounce off before he gets the chance to. Start watching "The Life Of Brian" a lot - you KNOW which scene
We were all young once & probably just as bad in our own way.

coolwalking · 02/08/2019 03:02

"I’ve found we disagree on politics only when it comes to issues affecting women"

Maybe a blunt 'You're not a woman' would suffice. Remind him he's a boy who should start respecting what actual women believe.

Original poster
Ritascornershop · 02/08/2019 02:56

I’m left wing, but also don’t accept party platforms blindly. Thus far he’s had a tendency to find a candidate he likes and slightly hero worship them. And he’s very passionate about all political issues, but this is the one thing he really won’t tolerate dissent on.

I think younger people are very much in an echo chamber on this. His sister is not, but she’s very bolshie and very much (my definition of) a feminist.

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Alislia17 · 02/08/2019 02:52

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coolwalking · 02/08/2019 02:49

I'm sorry I don't have any experience of this yet. Your post, to me, shows the amount of biased views being pushed onto young people now through institutions. It is tantamount to brainwashing if they aren't able to have a debate on a subject without flouncing out of a room.

The real world will be a shock to them. The whole 'tolerance of everyone and their beliefs' upbringing that a lot of left wing families have is going to cause no end of issues. It's ok for people to be critical of issues - we don't have to 'tolerate' things we don't agree with.

Original poster
Ritascornershop · 02/08/2019 02:47

Thanks Ginger. I would not be surprised to hear him agree that lesbians can have penises. Sigh. He just gets so emotional about it. I guess I long ago accepted that most people hold daft opinions and there’s nothing I can do about it. He seems perpetually outraged that people hold different opinions. I suppose I have to hope he outgrows the flouncing (& acquires some patience).

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Original poster
Ritascornershop · 02/08/2019 02:43

But I can’t stand arguing with people. He’ll be living at home for the coming year and I want that year to be peaceful and pleasant. We get along really well so long as we don’t talk about this sort of thing.

What upset him today was that he said the Americans in Afghanistan is terrible and that “most people in Afghanistan support the Taliban”. I had the temerity to say that probably most women didn’t. That reminded him of the time I disagreed on trans issues and he stamped off in a huff.

I do have a mania for sorting things out and not having people angry with each other, so there’s that.

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Gingerkittykat · 02/08/2019 02:41

My DD is very woke, one of the few things we clash over (except her desire to play K-pop in the car!) and really not much you can do. I've clearly stated my views on the issues, she has clearly stated hers. She does listen and has changed some viewpoints, the JY debacle is a good place to show what can go wrong. I've also showed her stories like the very young siblings in the USA who transitioned and had their sex legally changed aged 5 and 7 which she agreed was craziness. There are other things she will not shift on, i.e. she believes lesbians can have penises and a man with a beard can just identify as a woman and be accepted as such.

Ultimately I think we need to recognise that our kids might not disagree with us and just tolerate it. Them flouncing is not a good move, maybe best to just step away from the subject unless he brings it up.

Alislia17 · 02/08/2019 02:38

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maddy68 · 02/08/2019 02:36

Just be yourself. If they don't like it well......

Original poster
Ritascornershop · 02/08/2019 02:35

Oh, and he thinks “the vast, vast majority of feminists” are not gender critical. He had never heard the term gender critical till I said to him earlier in the week when I was explaining why TERF is a slur (& he looked it up, went to Reddit, and based on that has decided that anyone gender critical is either a far right religious nut or someone naive enough to get sucked in by them. Based on reading a Reddit thread). He’s also never heard of Jonathan Yaniv, Meghan Murphy, or Magdalene Berns.

Honestly, he is such a smart and kind person. But is the best way to live through young adults like this just to think about meerkats when they start in on their pet subject? I think a lot of people at that age ... their brains are sort of ready for a row.

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