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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

To those who visit the board and believe in gender identity, what is your solution?

442 replies

Doyoumind · 01/08/2019 13:21

I've been on Twitter again and seen another interesting thread but I'm not going to post it here so it can be picked apart.

Instead, although I know it's been asked before, to those of you who believe someone can be a woman without biologically being one I ask the question: What do you think should be put in place in law to provide safe spaces for trans people and women and what are you doing about it?

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TheBigBallOfOil · 01/08/2019 20:45

Studies do not show that mewk. There is no “brain chemistry and make up” belonging to each sex. Is someone has told you there is, then they have told you lies.

RedDogsBeg · 01/08/2019 20:41

Those are some of the consequences I was referring to LonginesPrime and it will get worse but those wishing to to throw those protections down the pan seem not to care one iota.

NeurotrashWarrior · 01/08/2019 20:40

I believe The lonely TS had ott gender roles from an early age forced on them which has led to the dysphoria. They're enjoying those activities while knowing they're a biological Male. Not an essence, just personality.

LTS knows full well what they are and are not.

mewk · 01/08/2019 20:38

Sex is biological
Gender is psychological

Sex and gender are not interchangeable
They were, before our knowledge on each expanded

There is more to sex than genitals too
And there are more chromosomes than xx (female) and xy (male)
There is xxy and xyy, not to mention others (such as Mutated X)

Unfortunately these types of things aren't taught until advance levels of biology and psychology, so the mass of public wont understand or even know these things exist
Which as you can imagine makes it very difficult to teach people why being transgender is more than a male wearing dresses (stereotyping here)

Studies show that trans people have the brain chemistry and makeup of the "opposite" of their gentials, so it actually aligns with their gender not their sex

And a subcategory of transgender being nonbinary (those who aren't man or woman - - could be both or neither)

Not to forget those born with ambiguous genitalia, having had their parents choose which genitals they want to remove /enhance when the child is born, are often trans also

TheBigBallOfOil · 01/08/2019 20:36

The people mistaking personal opinions for facts are the people insisting on female essences etc. If you stick with chromosomes as your basis for policy and law making, opinions can go hang. The people who want to believe in female essences can do so, with zero impact on the sane majority. That’s the right way to do things.
One day, some people are going to wake up and realise they went into battle in defence of the notion of a female essence. I mean, I’ve been drunk. But I’ve never had a hangover that bad. That’s quite something to wake up to.

FormerMediocreMale · 01/08/2019 20:36

Facial recognition software is transphobic as it classes transwomen as male.

Doyoumind · 01/08/2019 20:33

Beards, whether they are on males or females, are a consequence of biology.

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Doyoumind · 01/08/2019 20:31

Protected from whom mewk.

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LonginesPrime · 01/08/2019 20:31

If you change the definition of man and woman in law then that will impact on the laws in place to protect homosexuals as laws on homosexuality are based on the definitions of man and woman.

The laws don't protect homosexuals anyway as anyone who calls people out for homophobia / advocating conversion therapy is told they are actually transphobic.

Homosexuality isn't a thing now and neither is homophobia, apparently. Language has lost all meaning.

PetrolBastard · 01/08/2019 20:31

You can be a biological woman and have a beard. Lots of women have facial hair. Lots of women have a heavy set build or a strong jaw. Besides, I thought being a woman wasn't defined by any feminine characteristics?

WhoIsTheFairestOfThemAll · 01/08/2019 20:30

What I need is your acceptance that just maybe I love spending weekends shopping for clothes and makeup. That maybe I would rather stay at home and knit than go down the pub. That just maybe I would rather read Cosmopolitan than watch sports.

I read that blog. This is the final paragraph and it really just is all about the stereotypes.

I loathe shopping for clothes and don't wear make up. I can't knit, well unless you want a really long scarf with poor tension and I'd much rather be in the pub. I don't watch sport or read Cosmo.

So what am I?

I know the Lonely TS doesn't refer to himself as a woman but these are still stereotypical tropes associated with women that many women just don't recognise.

If choosing the more 'feminine' of these options is what makes you a woman, then I am not one.

In fact, I've already been told by a transgender person that I am trans.

It's just a nonsense. We need to classify people by their biological needs for al sorts of reasons and not their hobbies and interests or how long their hair is! Because that's irrelevant.

Doyoumind · 01/08/2019 20:29

There have been studies done that show even babies can tell the difference between men and women. It's innate in us.

Given that a lot of TRAs have stubble and even beards, it's really not that hard to tell. Even those on hormones have a man's build often.

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mewk · 01/08/2019 20:27

I don't think anything needs to be put in placed to segregate trans women from biological women, they're all women so they should all be protected.

PetrolBastard · 01/08/2019 20:26

Where is your statistics to prove that the vast majority don't pass? I wasn't aware that had been the subject of a study.

FormerMediocreMale · 01/08/2019 20:24

If you change the definition of man and woman in law then that will impact on the laws in place to protect homosexuals as laws on homosexuality are based on the definitions of man and woman.

Well if straight males can now be lesbians homosexuality becomes meaningless.

Doyoumind · 01/08/2019 20:24

That's the point Petrol. Without self ID if the current law is properly applied we can question the presence of someone we are not sure about and get them removed. With self ID they would potentially have a right to be there and to try and remove them would be illegal. Those are already the rules some places are trying to put in place.

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FormerMediocreMale · 01/08/2019 20:21

How do you tell the difference? If you are in a woman only space, how do you know who is trans and who isn't? Do you ask for proof of everyone around you?

The vast majority of transwomen dont "pass". If they do then they are more likely to be transexuals and less likely to be a danger.

RosesAndRaindrops · 01/08/2019 20:18

I asked, Roses, to see if you would pop off there with your transphobic views on biology, hang around for a few weeks and pop back to update us on your views

Biology isn't transphobic, it's fact. You can't biologically change sex, not yet anyway (who knows in the future what you can do)
regardless of whatever the extreme end says.
It's like the extreme end of GC - they don't speak for everyone, a lot have more moderate views where they're just legitimately concerned about self ID

PetrolBastard · 01/08/2019 20:16

The trans people I know come in the bathroom with me.

RedDogsBeg · 01/08/2019 20:16

If you change the definition of man and woman in law then that will impact on the laws in place to protect homosexuals as laws on homosexuality are based on the definitions of man and woman.

Aridane · 01/08/2019 20:11

I agree with dodge and navigator

Fizzypoo · 01/08/2019 20:11

The few trans women I have worked with were really happy with single sex and gender neutral loos. They felt they had a space for them that they could be comfortable in.

TRAs want our space. Not unhappy confused people who desperately want to be something other than what they are.

PetrolBastard · 01/08/2019 20:10

How do you tell the difference? If you are in a woman only space, how do you know who is trans and who isn't? Do you ask for proof of everyone around you?

stucknoue · 01/08/2019 20:10

There's a difference between sex and gender, thus you could feel like a woman, have surgery to look like a woman but genetically you are still a man. Where feasible we should accommodate those in society with gender dysphoria, but it will very depending on setting so things like clothing, uniform and the like let them wear what they want, in other low risk situations eg shop changing rooms let them go where they want, but where possible an option of mixed gender facilities should be offered for leisure centre changing rooms etc which work for families (my local has female, male, adapted and 3 family cabins which are unisex.).

For places like prison if there's sufficient numbers a specific unit should be established in the grounds of a male prison, just like they have for high risk female prisoners already, but it's a case by case basis.

Let people live how they want is really my thoughts but I would like to see a ban on any hormone treatment or surgery under 18 and compulsory counselling for at least 12 months before any medication can be prescribed - I know people can go overseas but we have to try, I know 4 young people who came out as trans in their teens, two have subsequently changed their mind (one is now in a straight relationship, the other in a gay one)

FormerMediocreMale · 01/08/2019 20:04

What makes you think trans women are safe from men who pretend to be women so they can assault someone?

How do they or we tell the difference between the "real" transwomen and the "fake" ones?

Having 3 categories provides for everyone, male/female/unisex but TRA wont accept that.

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