Are feminists getting played?

People who may get pregnant
People who may suffer from FGM
People who are sexually objectified
People who get raped
People who need abortions
People who need a female HCP
People who need a female prison
People who need a rape refuge
People who need a smear test
People who need menstrual products
People who need a pregnancy test

I mean the list just goes on and on.

You'd need an awful lot of paper every time you talked about women, wouldn't you!

This idea of equality with men works okay for a lot of women who don't have children.

I don't have children. Yet the very perception of me in the workplace as someone who might have children has in itself had an impact on my career. Funnily enough, it seems that male academics are perfectly able to recognise what a woman is when it comes to discriminating against us. Also, my fucking female biology is now having a detrimental effect on my productivity now that I am perimenopausal, with a womb full of large fibroids to boot. It's offensive to suggest that I don't have anything in common with other females just because I haven't expelled a human from my body. That is TRA manipulation of language.

Why does my life have to be broken down into segments? The time I was a menstruator, a miscarriage haver, a birther, a pregnant person, a breastfeeder and so on.

Can you not just say woman so I can talk about the cumulative impact of these events, rather than acting like a pregnancy just fell out of the sky and fell on me, and if it hadn’t I’d basically be a man. Because that is not how it works.

BUT ALL WOMEN ARE SUSCEPTIBLE TO PREGNANCY! At some point in their life. Or if not it's usually because of some female-only disease / condition so therefore also inextricably linked to female biology. FFS.

I see this is one of these threads

Yes, but as Datun says, for the lurkers...

👀👀

Yes, it is a big deal.

To talk about a phenomenon, you have to be able to define it. Historically, women were able to talk about the phenomenon of being female in a patriarchal society because they could define their class as biological female and there were commonalities within those parameters.

If you destroy the boundaries of those parameters but still retain the legal label for the definition, suddenly there are no shared commonalities between those individuals under the label "woman". You end up with an absurdist chaos.

And how can you agitate for, say, improved gynaecological or obstetric medical care when you then have "women" in positions of political power insisting that these are not a priority because not all women have a female reproductive system?

There has to be a legal definition for individuals of the female reproductive class because, otherwise, the specific issues that face those individuals cannot be recognised in law or by the state.

I wonder if we need to be a class. This idea of equality with men works okay for a lot of women who don't have children

Only if it's about the actual children. And even then it's often about not being able to have the actual children.

Women who don't have children are still disadvantaged!

This idea of equality with men works okay for a lot of women who don't have children.

I was discriminated against because of the potential to have children.

I never had children, do I get the back pay for promotions not given?

Plus, categorising a sex based on what genitals they do, or do not possess, will exclude all those who do/don't possess them.

Woman. Adult human female.

Job done.

I see this is one of those threads.

I know. But you have to show willing, occasionally. For the lurkers.

But if you 'roll-over' on the semantic stuff then women (or XX or whatever you replace the word women with) won't have any rights because written law refers to 'women' not 'XX' or 'womb havers' or whatever. In sport it's the 'women's' category. If that includes men then women will be outcompeted in virtually every sport (not darts, probably, I stand to be corrected). We'd have to organise to get an 'XX' category from scratch (and so on for any XX space or right).

Is trans really such a big deal?

It's men that are the problem. Trans is a vehicle/juggernaut that men use to make themselves more of a problem to females.

Hope that helps.

It's a total waste of time and shouldn't need to be done.

But it does. Without it, none of the rest stands.

I see this is one of those threads.
**
It's not even the weekend yet.

And just in time for some really important things happening for women that won't help the TRA narrative.

🤔

Anyway, threads like this are a distraction in themselves.

If we are no longer able to define what a woman is then we won’t have feminists as we won’t be able to define what a feminist is as we can’t define what a woman is 🤦‍♀️

It makes me sad that feminists are spending so much time banging on about bathrooms

Well...........that tells me everything I need to know about your knowledge of the 'Trans thing' and what you're objectives are.

"and that's all I've got to say on that"

I see this is one of those threads.

It's not even the weekend yet.

"Well, one way would just be to roll over on the semantic stuff, and just be womb-bearers or whatever. Don't get me wrong, I hate all that language, but it is just words."

Problem with that is if you accept the dehumanising language you are paving the way for the removal of rights. Removing women's rights is a slow, gradual process and it stars with language designed to dehumanise those whose rights are under threat.

Well, one way would just be to roll over on the semantic stuff, and just be womb-bearers or whatever. Don't get me wrong, I hate all that language, but it is just words.

It's not "just words". Words have meaning, and rights require definitions to be secure. TRAs have had some success in claiming the word "woman", and now they are going after "female". Once the category of "female" includes those with penises, you can kiss goodbye to your sex-based rights, because sex will be a fictional rather than material category.

It makes me sad that feminists are spending so much time banging on about bathroom

OH IS THAT ALL IT IS? SILLY ME.

Why aren't you starting the daily threads about the things you judge to be more important then OP? Anyone can start threads, but you seem to be complaining that "anyone" isn't doing your bidding?

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights?call=NewConversationPage

Well, one way would just be to roll over on the semantic stuff, and just be womb-bearers or whatever. Don't get me wrong, I hate all that language, but it is just words.

Not really. The idea is to colonise womanhood. Adopting the lingo will be a stickingplaster solution. Long-term, the plan is to eliminate sex differences, and therefore women as a class, with rights of their own.

Not all of us are womb bearers.
And the language changes so quickly.

I'm a woman.
A cunty one.