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Original poster

Are feminists getting played?

836 replies

Maniak · 26/07/2019 14:20

It makes me sad that feminists are spending so much time banging on about bathrooms in a world that has women still working for no pay, old women still more likely to be poor, surrogacy, underfunded maternity care, and poor support for carers. And other stuff.

Yes, the trans thing is annoying, but have you noticed how it always fires up before major elections? It's like Afghanistan in the 80s when the US provided just enough weapons to keep the war going so Russia would use all it's energy and get weak.

I feel like feminism is getting distracted with the trans stuff. At most, it should take up 10 percent of our feminist attention. But I rarely see feminism these days that isn't all about trans. Seriously. Do you think we're getting played here? Is trans really such a big deal?

OP posts:
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LassOfFyvie · 29/07/2019 19:13

She was saying it would happen without recourse because of changes to language because of trans

Which in the case of pregnancy it would not. The protection is given to the state of being pregnant. It's the same as employers making provision for breastfeeding- it is the act of breastfeeding which is protected.

BernardBlacksWineIceLolly · 29/07/2019 19:13

Consider victims of FGM @maniak

What do they have in common?

I’ll wait

FloralBunting · 29/07/2019 19:11

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ThatDoctorEM · 29/07/2019 19:10

Floral bunting was right - change the language then change the comparitor. If policies are sex blind, then they are blind to sex discrimination.

BernardBlacksWineIceLolly · 29/07/2019 19:10

Say what you mean @maniak, because at the moment I’m fucked if I know

LassOfFyvie · 29/07/2019 19:10

Maniak, do you really not get that if a woman is sacked because she is pregnant and tries to claim sex discrimination, if males are included in the group 'women', and women are in the group 'men' and we are in law just a mass of humanity only distinguished by who likes pink and who likes blue, she could be told she has no case because men can be pregnant too, and many of the 'women' aren't of the large gamete producing class?

Well your pregnant woman would not be arguing sex discrimination. Her case is she /he/they/ zey were dismissed because she/he/they/zey is pregnant. The protection is for being pregnant.

She doesn't even have to be sacked, no employer will have to hire women as their diversity ratings can just be men when the workforce 'identify' as women and BINGO

Could reality just intrude for a moment? Women are employed- women will continue to be employed.

I very much doubt that in a competition between 2 candidates of equal merit as employees that a 30 year old natal woman would lose out to a 30 year old trans woman. Who is going to fit in, who won't be difficult counts for a lot.

ThatDoctorEM · 29/07/2019 19:09

Jux why are you not defining woman and man buy sex? Why does what they like to wear come into it and how does clothing matter to Male violence? Are perpetrators influenced by masculine styles? Is a woman beaten because of a skirt?

Case by case still messes with the statistics and thus analysis and therefore ultimately policies of redress and prevention.

Original poster
Maniak · 29/07/2019 19:08

@BernardBlacksWineIceLolly just say what you mean. It'll be easier.

OP posts:
sackrifice · 29/07/2019 19:08

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BernardBlacksWineIceLolly · 29/07/2019 19:07

@maniak consider surrogates

why were those particular people selected to have their bodies exploited?

What do they have in common?

I’ll wait

Original poster
Maniak · 29/07/2019 19:06

Yeah I know women get discriminated against for pregnancy. You can hardly miss it. But floralbunting was saying more than that. She was saying it would happen without recourse because of changes to language because of trans.

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Jux · 29/07/2019 19:05

We really do need to be able to talk about male violence though. We can't do that if there are no lines between the two sexes, or if they're ridiculously blurred. Those who don't fit with the normal man or woman definitions are exceptions and will be treated on a case by case basis as necessary.

BernardBlacksWineIceLolly · 29/07/2019 19:04

Estimated [https://www.equalityhumanrights.com/en/managing-pregnancy-and-maternity-workplace/pregnancy-and-maternity-discrimination-research-findings 54,000 women a year] reported that they were either dismissed; made compulsorily redundant, where others in their workplace were not; or treated so poorly they felt they had to leave their job

And I can’t believe I’m having to tell someone on a feminist forum that for fucks sake

ThatDoctorEM · 29/07/2019 19:04

My gosh, do you really not know that women are discriminated against in the workplace for pregnancy and indeed sacked? It highlights the importance of words again, often instead of sacked it is phrased 'contract not renewed'.

Original poster
Maniak · 29/07/2019 19:03

@floralbunting "Maniak, are you having a laugh?"

I mean, has a woman been sacked for being pregnant as a direct result of changes to language because of trans. And no, I'm not joking. I haven't heard of a case like that.

OP posts:
JessicaWakefieldSV · 29/07/2019 19:01

🙈🙉🙊 I’m gonna Grey Rock

Original poster
Maniak · 29/07/2019 19:00

@BernardBlacksWineIceLolly

I'm sorry, I'm not sure what you're trying to say.

Only women can get pregnant, so if you're talking about pregnant people, it's a more accurate category than women because most women are not pregnant. (?)

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sackrifice · 29/07/2019 18:59

I'm not sure what the laws are but of course people shouldn't be sacked for being pregnant. Has that happened?

What, ever?

FloralBunting · 29/07/2019 18:59

Maniak, are you having a laugh?

sackrifice · 29/07/2019 18:59

She doesn't even have to be sacked, no employer will have to hire women as their diversity ratings can just be men when the workforce 'identify' as women and BINGO.

No need any more. Back to the kitchen ladies.

Goosefoot · 29/07/2019 18:58

FloralBunting

I think that's an important point but one which people find difficult. Once they get it, they see it and it's clear, but for some reason many have difficulty seeing how the protected characteristics of a group are related to the inherent physical characteristics of the group.

ThatDoctorEM · 29/07/2019 18:57

And what has placed them in this position of being pregnant and having to sell babies to others? Choices are not made in a vacuum.

Original poster
Maniak · 29/07/2019 18:57

@floralbunting I'm not sure what the laws are but of course people shouldn't be sacked for being pregnant. Has that happened?

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BernardBlacksWineIceLolly · 29/07/2019 18:54

They were chosen to be exploited because they were pregnant with babies for other people?

Talk about cart before the horse

Try again