Study finds high rates of autism in transgender and non-binary population

I can see how this is happening.
I'm a late diagnosed woman with ASD. I always wanted to be a boy when I was young- I could tell I was different from the girls; and I really really didn't understand the social intricacies between girls. So I chose to play football with the boys instead - this involved less talking and was a lot more straightforward. I had short hair as I wasn't bothered about hair care / styles, and preferred to wear trousers and T-shirts to dresses. Have always disliked pink and blue was my favourite colour, never played with dolls but had action figures instead.
When my period started (I was only 11) I was terrified and hid it from my mum for a good year or so. I couldn't understand what was going on with my body and hated it. Even worse when my boobs started to grow and the boys started treating me differently. I really wanted it all to stop. I think if I had been a tween now, I'd have done anything to stop puberty and remain a 'boy'...
FWIW I don't regret being a woman now! But I think at that age, such a fundamental change is terrifying for autistic girls and no wonder they want to stop it. Also the feeling different from others and grasping at any explanation for it.

As others have said I bet the 35% is much higher especially in the girls.
My DD has ASD, some would call it mild although in theory it doesn't work like that you either have ASD or don't if you have it some people show much more outward manifestations/symptoms of it than others, anyway I'm digressing.

The only reason my DD has a diagnosis is because there's a strong history of ASD in my DH family and as we are familiar with the symptoms of ASD we recognised them in her did some research around ASD in girls and recognised more characteristics of ASD then pursued a diagnosis.

Without our knowledge of ASD we could have dismissed some of her behaviour as being naughty and other as quirkyness it's so easy for girls and higher functioning autistics to go undiagnosed.

Is there a way to find out what schools are teaching kids about transgender. I'm drumming into ds head that boys are boys and girls are girls, regardless what you do and you cant change sex. But he is asd and takes what he learns at school as law. I'm in Scotland and is is a big worry of mine.

www.latimes.com/opinion/story/2019-07-18/doctor-transgender-child-lgbtq-healthcare?fbclid=IwAR0xBkyLpZoqNkliPYlMRb3Qr-qP1r9JElio6kVxqHw8v21AHgqot0DkbAE

No signs of being trans at all, until at 13 the child declared it. Kid did have sensory and social issues.

A WHOLE 15 months later mum's got the kid on hormones.

This has been a miraculous cure for all the kid's problems, apparently. She's writing a book I think. Naturally.

medium.com/@kirstyentwistle/an-open-letter-to-dr-polly-carmichael-from-a-former-gids-clinician-53c541276b8d

I’d also be interested to see the total number of kids with ASD rather than just moderate to severe. I imagine it must be more than half of all those referred which is pretty horrifying when you consider the likely loss of fertility should they proceed with puberty blockers
I read about yet another GIDS clinician voicing their concerns about the referral process and the fact they are pretty much guaranteed to go along with what the child is saying even if there is clear evidence of trauma /ASD /family issues

35% autistic (minimum) at referral?? that's amazing.

A few months ago I saw a post from a FB friend - she was telling the world how she had explained to her primary-aged, ASD child that if they didn’t want to be one gender, they could go to the doctor and be made the opposite gender. It was very much a ‘I need to avoid my young DC misgendering anyone and here’s how I went about it’ post. It made me really worry for the child - I’m sure the DC now believes a doctor can change their sex.

She’s a very black and white thinker with a history of rows (online and offline) so I saw no point in starting an argument. But it seems we are in a world where parents are indoctrinating their own, vulnerable, DC with the idea that it’s possible (even easy, usual) to change sex. While I’m happy for adults to believe what they want, this seems to me to be encouraging otherwise oblivious children to consider changing sex, risking a lifetime of medical intervention and disappointment when the results aren’t what they hoped for.

Violet - you are not alone. My 21 DD ASD has identified as trans for 3 years now.
My gut feeling is that it won't last forever but she will always have our love and support whatever happens. At the moment I'm just glad we are in a holding pattern and that the waiting list for the GID clinic is really long...

My youngest is autistic and delayed developmentally. He doesn't really understand the distinction between boys and girls when looking at pictures or people just like he can't always understand other people's emotions. He also doesn't always understand where someone else starts and he ends in that if someone else is hurt or in trouble he also thinks it is happening to him. For a while he said he was a girl, because he has sisters and he thought he was the same as them. It took reinforcing to explain to him that he is a boy and why. It is a neurodevelopmental disorder which can affect understanding of issues around biological sex and societal identities. These children and young people are vulnerable to manipulation by social pressure, misinformation, people with an agenda and pharmaceutical companies and doctors (who have a financial interest) in them who can see the £££ in medicating and experimenting wholesale on children and young people without adequate research into the long term effects. Then they will make more money from treating the same side effects in years to come.

I believe the high number of girls referred to gd services who may also have asd and so do not conforming to gender stereotypes and also find it very hard to socialise with other girls and so feel they don't fit in.
This ^^ In an autistic brain it can be 'does not feel like fits in with other girls' + 'prefers masculine clothes due to more comfortable fit' = 'must really be male'. Luckily when I was younger being trans wasn't really a thing so I just didn't fit in and then came out as gay (with the more 'butch' side from the clothing and having short hair for ease). I bet there are a lot of autistic kids being shoved into a trans identity when they really need someone telling them that a, they have autism and b, it's fine to not fit in to gender stereotypes

I was just looking at GIDS statistics taken from this paper published in the last few days.

adc.bmj.com/content/103/7/631.full?ijkey=HsMwyZDRtsKu83z&keytype=ref

It states that "Around 35% of referred young people present with moderate to severe autistic traits"

I believe they use DSM criteria for diagnosing these autistic traits which has 3 levels of severity: L1, requiring support, L2, requiring substantial support, L3, requiring very substantial support.

Why do their statistics only count moderate (L2) and severe (L3) and not L1s?

What is the real instance of ASDs among those referred 50%, 60%, 70%?

I wonder if the WHO's announcement that it is not a mental illness will one day be reversed.

@VioletLeaf I'm sure everybody is grand about it until it's THEIR child.

The media is desperately trying to normalise this phenomenon and accusing people who resist/object as hateful. Just look at all the programming on tv about it and all over YouTube.

It's so insidious.

I have been worried about this with regard to my very woke friend. Her daughter, 8, is autistic and she's recently started doing a lot of advocacy about that, and she's really bought into the whole trans narrative. I think she is likely autistic herself really.

She posted a thing just recently from a local LGBT org about how autistic persons are more likely to be gender diverse, and it's presented in such a way as to be completely positive about it, because you know, its all about diversity and neurodiversity! She suggested in her comments it was because autistic people didn't feel bound by social rules! and that maybe there was a link with the genetic causes of both.

I really worry for her little girl. The whole idea that being 'gender diverse" seems to mean wearing clothes culture associated with the opposite sex kind of infuriates me. In the end though I suggested the reasons other autistic women I know have said they felt that way, particularly discomfort with the physicality of puberty and menstruation, and rigidity around social roles.

Oddly there has been zero response.

I'm ashamed that I am unable to just blanket accept it the way other people think I should.

@VioletLeaf are you ashamed of the shame you are experiencing about your son? If so, please don't be so hard on yourself. It really is not your fault (nor your son's fault). We really are being played by some very clever manipulative agenda. They've done their utmost to confuse vulnerable people in their attempt to destroy the family. Wishing you peace xx

Thank you everyone. Unfortunately my son is older (in his 20's) and so there is very little we can do or say. He thinks this is the root of all his anxieties etc, which will disappear once he transitions. We think he is making a terrible mistake, but we love him and will not stop loving or supporting him. His attitude towards us and the world has become very militant and hard about it all. It's incredibly difficult. We are grieving and struggling but expected to be upbeat and positive about it all. I don't know what the future holds, but it seems likely things will be very difficult.. and honestly? I'm scared. And ashamed of feeling this way.

Internalized Homophobia is More Powerful than You Know www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3642547-internalized-homophobia-is-more-powerful-than-you-know

This film is a conversation between two de transitioned women but describes how much online media played a part, not fitting in, not seeing themselves represented in the online media as anything other than a trans man. No lesbians or GNC women.

This is significant for children with autism as the online world is often an extremely huge part of their lives.

So yes, there is a significant link for me to ROGD/ girls/ asd. But also for young boys too, though the way "drag" is being marketed now I suspect more of these boys who are into the stereotypical girl stuff will begin to "come out" (hate that phrase) as drag interested rather than trans - certainly Desmond is amazing has autism.

This thread / film shows a young woman with autism realising she isn't trans after all, does have issues with 'gender' and so far still binding. Using YouTube to describe this so undoubtedly uses YouTube/ tumblr etc.

Young detransitioner talks about why she isn't transgender www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3642040-young-detransitioner-talks-about-why-she-isn-t-transgender

I believe the high number of girls referred to gd services who may also have asd and so do not conforming to gender stereotypes and also find it very hard to socialise with other girls and so feel
They don't fit in.

YouTube is a very common obsession for young people with asd for a range of reasons - often has many films on special interests or supports learning about the world. My niece who is autistic has learnt a lot more about "being a girl" from watching videos on YT which has supported her social skills actually.

But obviously YouTube has endless trans films and many de transitioned women have described falling down trans rabbit holes while seeking answers to why they don't feel they fit in.

For many they're lesbian and non conforming. For some they may also be autistic.

I don't find it hard to join dots and I do think this is part of a wider feminist concern regarding ROGD in young girls.

@VioletLeaf I'm so sorry.
I can relate a little. My son (also autistic) wanted to be a girl when he was in year 1. Wanted to wear a girls uniform to school (cried about it). I was deceived at the time thinking I could support him through it, I talked to my therapist about it (pnd). I allowed him to wear girls pj's. Yet something did not sit right with me. I knew 'society' was now supportive of this but I did not feel it was 'right' in my own mind. In the end, I sat him down and explained how the girl he liked in class would not be interested in him as a 'girl' and if he was a girl, then he wouldn't get to kiss a girl when he got older as they would want a boy to kiss and not a boy pretending to be a girl.

That thankfully sorted the whole thing out and he gradually quit wanting to be a girl.

He still is very fascinated with makeup etc but I'm quite firm with him now, saying that make up is for girls only.

I know this situation is different from yours. And I know how heavy this can weigh on your heart as you love your child. Yet, you can be loving and supportive whilst telling your child they are 100% perfect the way God made them. By supporting their fixation to trans is subtlety confirming to a child that there's something wrong with them.

There are pluses to your situation, in that your child is open and honest with you. When I was younger, I got strange thoughts and feelings that I wanted to be a man but I never had the courage to tell anyone. I know now, that it was a phase or an OCD fixation for me.

The media is pushing this agenda and the poor children have no idea that they are being played.

I haven't read the whole thread but why is this in this forum? It's nothing to do with feminism or exclusively female related?

Violet