Well this explains a lot. Apparently we're all Bi whether we know our or not....

yeah, They say that because that's what they WANT to be true ...

They are just obsessed with sex aren't they!

And when you're talking about influencing my element so that I 'learn to cope' with sex with people with penises, as if I had no right to make such choices for myself, or act on my own preferences and recognise my own sense of attraction and arousal, or had any right to expect that sex would be something I enjoyed rather than 'learned to cope with' -

frankly it gets a bit hard to be polite.

More to the point, I will not be pity/duty fucking anyone, ever, with or without a penis.

Or that conversion therapy or corrective rape is a good thing.

I thought I was way over on the heterosexual female end of the scale, and I think for a long time I really was, but I've found certainly at a later stage of life I'm much less exclusively straight than I thought.

Crucially, this is a conclusion I've reached for myself through my own choices, not because I have had women demanding that I have sex with them and telling me that my sexuality is not good enough unless I do.

If I'm honest I do believe that sexuality for most people is potentially fluid - it's a huge mix of cultural, personal and biological strands that I believe can change. That doesn't mean though that being exclusively same sex oriented doesn't exist, or that it only exists to be overcome by others.

But I know that I'm not bisexual. Not because of societal norms, simply because I only find one sex attractive. I'm not sure that societal norms can be used as a reason for those who are same sex attracted either!

I don't really know how someone would tell the difference, between attraction that was shaped by social norms, and that wasn't.

What we can say though is that looking at group behaviour, it changes in different environments. That's a fairly objective observation. Which suggests that there is some element that can be influenced regarding how people, or some people, experience sexual attraction.

Are you thinking of the Kinsey scale?

Indeed. Which is not at all new, so I don't see it as something we can blame on trans advocacy.

By pro trans figures, only 9% of lesbians don't decline MTFs as partners.

Then you think they'd be able to leave that 9% in peace and be happy with the 91% apparently gladly queuing up.

I was interested to read recently that most men with a transgender identity have comorbid personality disorders, the most common being NPD.

This makes sense when you consider the degree of shameless egotism required to demand that people have sex with you even though you know they're not sexually attracted to you.

The contrast between this and the behaviour of the old school transsexuals is striking.

As with so much of the trans/MRA/AWA/SJW ideologies and rhetoric, it conflates separate issues to confuse people. It's like saying to someone who likes cheese and finds jeans uncomfortable, "You'll like these jeans because I've put a piece of cheese in the pocket."

It is often claimed that it is only a tiny minority of lesbians who decline transwomen but given the bitching and whining from certain quarters, that simply cannot be true.

It's not. By pro trans figures, only 9% of lesbians don't decline MTFs as partners.

Goose
Are you thinking of the Kinsey scale? en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kinsey_scale

Most people are attracted to the opposite sex.

Except that’s not quite true.

Most people are attracted to a very small subset of the opposite sex.

The ‘everyone is bi’ theory holds that because someone is attracted to the opposite sex they must have some attraction for members of the same sex because there’s some overlap in gender expression.

But it’s not true.

A straight woman’s attraction to men doesn’t shade into women because they find most men unattractive. They don’t get close to fancying women.

Same with men, only more so. If they aren’t attracted to all women most aren’t going to be attracted to any men.

And the same goes for gay men and lesbians. They are attracted to a relatively small number of members of the same sex. It’s not an attraction to that entire sex, and it doesn’t extend to members of the opposite sex who might present as members of the same sex.

Gay men do not fancy butch lesbians. Lesbians are not, as a rule, attracted to effeminate men.

Fundamentally it is a waste of everyones time. Why hang around lesbians when quite simply they do not want you? I wouldn't dream of pestering straight women for sex as I know they are not attracted to me. What gives these people the arrogance that somehow they can push in where they are not wanted?

There are Bi/pan/straight women who are far more likely to be receptive of them.

They do often claim that only a handful of ‘terf-y’ lesbians object to penis, well, in that case, since they’ve allegedly got the vast majority of lesbians on their side why not stick to dating them and leave the others alone? Hmm it couldn’t be that the trans-accepting lesbians aren’t quite as numerous and gagging to fuck them as they’d have us believe could it?

I agree aspley

There's a dating pool of people who wouldn't mind sleeping with transpeople with their original biological genitals (just like there is a heterosexual dating pool, a lesbian pool, a gay pool). Why do some insist on thinking they have the right to coerce people who aren't interested into sexual acts they don't want?

The group of TRA transwomen who push this agenda never say heterosexual men should sleep with them (I'm guessing because as transwomen with male genitals they are not interested in homosexual sex acts), but when it comes to women having a sexual orientation based on sex is having a genital fetish and literal violence. It's mental gymnastics.

@LolaSmiles
There is a never ending stream of transwomen "lesbians" - if any of these lesbians/bi's who claim to like penises put their money where their mouths are, they would be quids in when it came to finding a partner, literally hundreds of them.

Strangely enough I think most are all mouth and are just talking progressive shit (presumably so people won't call them terfs and hate them) yet secretly hope it will be other lesbians who do the deed.

It is often claimed that it is only a tiny minority of lesbians who decline transwomen but given the bitching and whining from certain quarters, that simply cannot be true.
It is disgusting homophobic gaslighting

Funny, I think seeing that prefix of

'I think' or 'I believe'

I was thinking of you, Fermats + when I read DrEM's thread about consent (the whole is well worth reading):

In general, we see in rape cases men claim to be confused around consent, like penetrating a woman when she doesn't want sex is just bad sexual manners, yet as soon as age of consent debates arise they become bloody experts and can determine the 'nuance' between kids & teens.

A new trend in the rough sex defence to murder positions men as slaves to consent - they had to because she was asking for it...

We need to culturally reconceptualise sex so it is not constructed as something a woman just allows, just agrees to (consent), but is thought of as something a woman actively participates in and enjoys.

twitter.com/PankhurstEM/status/1149580183336153088

If this notion that none of us is allowed to refuse another's advances/demands for fear of being thought to be a bigot of some sort rather than an autonomous adult who chooses to acknowledge one's own preferences and boundaries - where exactly is this supposed to end?

This tangent is also brought to you by some of the most recent testimony in the JY thread.

It would suit some people to argue consent is a social construct.

It must be terrible realising that nobody wants to date you or sleep with you due to such horrible self-obsessed attitudes that act as a big red warning flag, leaving you feeling that eroding the definition of consent is your only option for having a shag.

It appears to be arguing that consent is merely a social construct, and if we hadn't been socially conditioned, we'd all be polyamorous, which I think is a euphemism for "prepared to let any perve who fancies it shag us while we lie back and think of England."

Yet another piece of rape apologism from the Woke.

It really is a men's sexual rights movement rapist's charter.

I genuinely thought I'd read arguments that bi is deprecated because it's, well, bi and that the appropriate term (for some groups) is that bi people are expected to be pan to signal willingness to accept > 2 genders?

It should be said that I don't understand this topic beyond what I read and this is probably apparent from my explanation. And is supposed to explain why I opted out of using the term bisexual.

I can see why someone might say it, and perhaps it's so, but I know that I don't feel any urge to touch someone else's vulva. Much like I know that on a man, I find shoulders attractive, whereas some people go for legs or forearms.

I suspect, that like many things, it's going to be a bit of both. I think that like taste in food, if you grow up in a place that eats cheese, you're more likely to eat cheese, but also that some people in that cheese-eating place still won't like cheese, and some people will absolutely adore it, and that whilst you might be socially pushed into gaining an appreciation of cheese, the fact of the matter is that you just might not like it and making you eat it isn't going to change that.