Supporting our lesbian sisters THREAD EDITED BY MNHQ AT OP'S REQUEST

I must admit I got a bit anxious about me posting About L fest on here. Like it's going to be infiltrated next year

It does feel a bit frantic doesn’t it?

I think it's a growing panic about the failure of #nodebate Bernard. Sport, safeguarding, JY, the Tavistock scandal, the NSPCC, Karen White, the "hobbies" of the advisers to the government and organisations being exposed, acceptance without exception being taken literally by paedophiles and fetishists and all the 'this never happens' happening - in public and openly reported. Add to this expecting society to accept a redefinition of same sex attraction and being furious when people don't agree
All these forbidden conversations happening - and this week even on the BBC and in the Guardian! In open defiance of the rooolz

Is it the heat do you think?

I will ask the lesbians I know what we bi and straight women can do to help at the next meeting of the super-secret underground women's group that I attend. It's underground because that's the only way we can keep penis-havers out.

Indeed Bernard. An advanced search usually throws up enough information to distinguish between someone genuinely wanting to explore an issue versus a GF.

The whole intervention from teflon was flipping weird tbh

I don’t know of any lesbian forums anymore, which is a shame as I’ve met some good friends online. If anyone knows of any, and I mean genuine ones, please could they DM me a link?

I think what Teflon is trying to say is that the opinions of all the lesbians who post on here don’t count, because we aren’t all the other lesbians. Ergo any lesbian who posts will be automatically discounted for the reason that they are posting. It’s ridiculous logic, designed to dismiss anyone who disagrees because only acceptable woke groupthink counts, and anyone who goes against it must be an outlier. It’s a total waste of time to engage with so I’m not engaging anymore.

The lesbian forums on Reddit, but for one, are all moderated by transwomen. Autostraddle, which began as a site for lesbians, is now run by transwomen. Almost all feminist sites are owned by men. After Ellen, too, began as a site for lesbians and was taken over by transwomen, but at last that site has been purchased by a lesbian who is again publishing it for lesbians and has a great deal to say about the problem posed by transbians in lesbian spaces, for which their increasing readership is grateful.

There is virtually NO lesbian representation, and certainly very little spending of monies for lesbians, in any of the major LGBT organisations. In fact, lesbians are being thrown out of leadership positions in such organisations — see for instance Martina Navritolova and Julia Beck.

So I would suggest that the fact that lesbians are being silenced and their voices being sock-puppeted online by transactivists means that you cannot gauge lesbian support for transactivism by what you read online.

A more interesting gauge is the recent study done showing that something like only 9% of lesbians would consider a transwoman as a sexual partner. That tells me that 91% of lesbians do not believe TW are actually women.

I’m quite sure that most lesbians, as is true of most feminists, want TW protected from discrimination in employment and housing and want TW safe from male violence. It’s possible to legislate for that without creating laws that say TWAW; it’s possible to protect TW as TW while also protecting women as women.

It is the insistence that TW ARE women in each and every respect and therefore entitled to everything women have fought for to alleviate millennia of subjugation TW were never subject to that is the sticking point.

That, and the issue of forcing people to believe something counter to material reality.

That kind of gives lesbians a bad rep. I wonder if these lesbian chat forums are actually run by men 🤔

Teflon has piqued my interest about lesbian forums so I've just googled "lesbian chat forums". I signed up for the first one and it immediately took me to the grossest porny shit.

Yet again I'm baffled by people who rely on The Equality Act who try to undermine it.
The Act defines lesbians as women who are same sex attracted. People who are attracted to both sexes are defined as bisexual.

widespread support among lesbians for the views expressed on these forums appear fairly bogus

I don't think anyone here is claiming anything about figures.
This is just a thread supporting those lesbians who do regard these things as a problem.

Also, I don't see lesbian forums as obsessed with trans people as you are on here. What does that tell you?

Interesting.

Do you know any lesbian forums, public ones, which do not admit men identifying as women?

Or bars. Or festivals. Or clubs.

I think (genuinely) all female groups are important to many women, I know I really value the ones I’m a member of

I help to organise one, so probably by doing that I’m tangentially supporting lesbians

I do regard lesbians as the canaries in the coal mine regarding women’s rights, so it’s important to understand what challenges they face and support them where possible

*If the likes of Get The L Out have any real support then please tell me about the thousands of lesbians who have been in contact expressing their concerns about trans people and then I might think there's an issue. Perhaps people on here would be better off getting out from behind their keyboards, meeting a few lesbians in the real world (I mean somewhere apart from a WPUK type event...).

Again with the you couldn't make it up logic.

"Please tell me about all the swathes of lesbians who've got a problem with this, who I don't believe exist. But don't go anywhere near any meeting where these swathes of lesbians are gathering..."

🤣

And, Teflon, good luck with the rubbish logic to erase sexual orientation as a concept, ("no one cares, and even when they do, you shouldn't listen").

I'm sure you'll get tons of support.

Also, I don't see lesbian forums as obsessed with trans people as you are on here. What does that tell you?

I'm imagining something entirely different to what it tells you.

Quod erat demonstrandum.

Also, I don't see lesbian forums as obsessed with trans people as you are on here. What does that tell you?

What are lesbian forums? Can you link?

The set up in Wales sounds lovely, very friendly. Is Pride month a big thing there?

Umm No lesbians tend to go to Pride in Manchester or Chester in England when it's on. I know some like to go and others think it's a waste of time and don't see the point in making lesbianism political.

Funny that the non-political lesbians love L fest, which they regard as just enjoying being in a woman friendly environment. So Maybe they are inadvertently being more political than they think.

Could all our straight and bi sisters please report Teflon’s malicious derailing and tell HQ that the targeting and undermining of lesbians is not in the spirit...

There's no targeting of lesbians here, just pointing out that claims on here about widespread support among lesbians for the views expressed on these forums appear fairly bogus. Also, I don't see lesbian forums as obsessed with trans people as you are on here. What does that tell you?

(Oops hadn’t refreshed - that comment was to sakura from upthread)

No, no - they were/are appreciated and interesting (please do share more!), was more just referring to that particular point being debated. If that makes sense

The set up in Wales sounds lovely, very friendly. Is Pride month a big thing there?

I’m genuinely confused as to wtf Teflon is trying to convey here, or more to the point, why they feel the need to tell us off at all.

Do you have a dog in the fight here Tef? Are you a female homosexual?

I’m rather pissed off that HQ are allowing this kind of derailing on a support thread for lesbians. If there was a similar support thread for another minority it wouldn’t be allowed to happen. The fact that is is being allowed should tell you all you need to know about the current targeting and erasure of lesbians.

Could all our straight and bi sisters please report Teflon’s malicious derailing and tell HQ that the targeting and undermining of lesbians is not in the spirit, and that you feel that it’s unacceptable that they continue to enable it. Then report every single poster who comes on here with the specific intention of shouting over and berating lesbians and the women who support us.

Yes there are plenty of lesbians online , especially on YouTube who have very strong views.
It seems to be true, also, that there are quite a few lesbians who don't really pay attention to the issues, or are openly supportive of trans rights.
There might be a socio economic divide is what i'm saying. Transwomen tend to be educated, middle class and possibly quite wealthy: they will be over represented in universities for sure