Is NSPCC school guidance for kids re sexual abuse shifting the Overton Window? Need expert advise to break this down.

I think there needs to be an enquiry into the NSPCC now

Completely agree with this but I don’t think it will happen until the general public get to hear about the latest problems with safeguarding & staff behaviour. At the moment all the outrage is on the internet.

My school friend was raped by her father from the age of about 13 ( could have been younger, my feeling is that it was, but I don’t know ) right through university. She lived alone with him, and he had groomed her to the extent that they were like a couple. She carried on “choosing” to live with him into her twenties. She committed suicide at 30.

Also lots of legitimate things adults do might make a child feel somewhat frightened or worried. Like being told someone is ill or had died. Or for some children just being told off for misbehaving at school. We can try and help them deal with things but cannot protect them from all negative feelings.
For an abused child, if the abuse is discovered, what follows can be more frightening or worrying than the abuse.
What a confusing message this sends.

I think there needs to be an enquiry into the NSPCC now.
Now. Yesterday in fact.

I'm not an expert either but agree with you 100%, just based on speaking to survivors of CSA. Children believe what adults tell them at the time. Sometimes the reaction to CSA kicks in years later; a girl I knew was a seemingly happy well adjusted child, despite several years of CSA in early childhood. In her teens she suffered enourmous mental health problems, drug addiction, problems with boundaries and keeping herself safe, allowing bad people into her life and massive self harm.
The guidelines have no need to be vague, or based on children's feelings or opinions. Its enough to say any romantic or sexual (genital) contact, including kissing and the viewing of pornographic material, imposed on children is abuse.
It's really not hard to say to children "nobody but you touches your bits, no adult has the right to ask you to keep a secret, and adults are only allowed to have boyfriends and girlfriends who are also adults."
The whole NSPCC thing is increasingly sinister. It's enough to make you start believing in conspiracy theories tbh.

Yes, this is extremely concerning as it shifts the focus from the wrongful behaviour of the adult to the reaction of the child.

We've all seen adult women who are confused about whether they were abused or not, due to socialisation.

I think there needs to be an enquiry into the NSPCC now.

share the unease about the wording of this and am particularly concerned having seen the NSPCC's recent actions in advocating the removal of sex segregated spaces, refusing to speak out about organisations undermining key aspects of safeguarding (confidentiality, parental alienation, advocating self harming activities such as breast binding) alongside the emerging scandal about NSPCC staff and sexually inappropriate behaviour in the workplace.

I find this extremely worrying.

I wasn't frightened or worried when my abuser made me suck him off, I was confused. Then I was made to believe I had nothing to worry about. But if I told anyone what I'd done I'd have nowhere to live.
I never told anyone.

It needs to be plain speak.
Touching genitals / being asked to show your genitals etc. The original definition of sex sbuse works fine.

This is a good thread

twitter.com/GoonerProf/status/1139142654191702016

Can I just say that I have the utmost admiration for your stance on this and have seen the unfair treatment you've received on twitter because of it. You are a true warrior woman.

I'm by no means an expert. Just have an interest in child safety. The rewording of language concerning this is abhorrent. I'm sure there are many professionals on here that could assist you. I hope my reply helps bump this to their attention.

What I can say is that children have a built in survival instinct. It is entirely personal to them. People (read predator) pleasing, acting out (rebellion) or disassociation are all very different but valid responses to abuse. I only say this as while it's good to point out how badly they have misinterpreted a "people pleasing" response. It would probably help to show how it is just as valid as these others. Also I imagine that the child would have a lot of guilt/self blame for having that type of response, particularly once they reach the reality of what has occurred.

Jeez, my response is garbled, I've been struggling with a bad cold/bad sleep past few nights and it is way past my bedtime. I hope you can manage to translate my word salad. Best of luck.

Experienced & trained (level 3 NSPCC ) in safeguarding in schools.

I share the unease about the wording of this and am particularly concerned having seen the NSPCC's recent actions in advocating the removal of sex segregated spaces, refusing to speak out about organisations undermining key aspects of safeguarding (confidentiality, parental alienation, advocating self harming activities such as breast binding) alongside the emerging scandal about NSPCC staff and sexually inappropriate behaviour in the workplace.

But I do want to see the context - ie what is said before and after this statement in the publication. As you state so clearly, the challenge is to present information to young children in an age appropriate way and sometimes, in trying to simplify issues, we do inadvertently lose certain key information.

If the standard definition in every other NSPCC publication includes the relevant information about consent, adult responsibility etc, then I am likely to think it's unintentional and trying to simplify a challenging issue (badly). However, given their current appalling reputation, it is right to treat this with great suspicion and wonder whether this is another sign of the sinister appropriation of the charity by those working to deliberately weaken our safeguarding frameworks for children.