The shifting language around the T issue.

If transness can only be experienced by the trans
But if you say you're trans then that's probably what you are (I've seen this a lot on Twitter)
Then by saying we are trans we will understand transness in all its complexity

Great!

Great thread OP, language and meaning are sacred. I'm also a stickler for grammar so 'they' singular does not replace singular pronouns as a preferred pronoun.

I don't have anything to add this early on a Sunday, and not to derail, but if anyone fancies a Sunday night movie I watched Arrival recently. It's sci-fi but hinges on language, meaning, connections and understanding. It was quite thought provoking.

Well that's nice for them that they're so boundless and special.

What I keep coming back to with all of this though is "but what about sex?". They can harp on all they like about gender and how their gender identity is special but what about sex? It's nonsensical how they're denying this physical reality that affects literally all animals on the planet.

Cislation, is just a way of trying to vilify anyone who understands what propaganda is, and the forms it takes.

Its a defense against being called out as propaganda. Its utterly cultist to set up a defensive narrative in this way.

I'm grateful to anyone who picks apart the use of word salad language for this reason. All word salad is, is propaganda.

I'm a great believer that there is value in good communication where language is simple enough for the majority to understand but not so oversimplified as to render the message as distorted or to lose the importance of its content and meaning.

Communication is a skill. There is a fine balance to getting it right. People think its easy, and anyone can do it, but actually it's really difficult to do well.

The thing is you can get your head around dysphoria, and also have sympathy for it. That's why we get people coming to scold us about how awful it must be to be trapped in the wrong body, we're so mean etc. But then you have a "what is non binary" thread like the one in chat the other day and it's wall to wall "not true trans", "attention seeking nonsense", "special snowflake" stuff. And really, NB is just scratching the surface of the trans weirdness. It might give them power in the cult, but in the real world people have no time for it. And whilst people seem to be fine with sweeping societal change like accepting men can literally be women, minor bureaucratic change (like "Mx" options on forms) drives them potty. If NB people start seriously angling for NB options on passports there'll be a public revolution. Men in women's prisons? Fine. An X on their passport? Might as well ask them to adopt the Euro! The further this moves from the medical modal and the closer to NB/ Genderfluid bollocks, the easier it'll be to shoot down. No more "but lady brain science", no more "but dysphoria", just regular people's kids coming home from school to ask their tired stressed parents if they can be a boy one day and a girl the next and those parents (who don't really give a flying fuck even about the "real" trans people, much less this transcendent brain twattery") will go into schools and crucify the teachers until they purge it from the curriculum.

That's my hope anyway. No one outside the cult gives a shit about being a "cis ally". If they can wear a rainbow badge and virtue signal once a year then fine, but anything more active and they really aren't going to do it. Dicyphering that word salad is work that no one is going to do, so they'll just rip up the homework and shout at the teacher.

Monitors: Stop trying to make "cis" happen. It's never going to happen.

It sounds like the kind of thing piped into people’s bedrooms while they sleep in a sinister science fiction film.

‘Nothing is real. Nothing is fixed. When you awake you will be boundless and limitless. You are transcendent. All inferior beings who stand in your way must be eliminated...’

I have tended to think that a lot of what is supposedly "transness" is some form of identity disorder. Not all the same - these guys are one example that reminds me of NPD, some remind me more of BPD, teenage girls are another maybe more related to adolescence, maybe there could be many types that are showing themselves this way.

The mistake people have made recently seems to have been to think that this is a sexual disorder. Which is new, not long ago it seems to have been understood that it was a disorder around gender identity. But now its even moving on from the sex disorder idea to something new.

This is literally narcissism being very literally and directly expressed through cod-mysticalism, isn't it?

I cannot be defined or limited, and certainly no one can ever put boundaries on me in any way! Anything you say I am, I am better than! The normies will never understand the sheer power of my outstandingness, but I understand about them. Trans is short for transcendent (continued page 94)

It's basically a long paean to the author's failure to develop a functional sense of identity. Instead of the ego shrinking into one-with-everything-ness as in a person who has attained some form of "enlightenment" the dysfunctional ego has bloated to become identified with everything.

It has blown me a way a little, the speed at which the language and concepts have moved in this discussion. It makes it very difficult to talk to people about it. Someone like my mother, who just isn't spending her time interacting with these ideas, still thinks in terms of body dysphoria. My father on the other hand is in a position where he is supposed to be keeping up on it because it impacts policy decisions, and he is still mainly familiar with a medicalised or concrete type of language. Almost no one I talk to other than students really knows the queer theory stuff, if they have heard the terms at all they tend to misunderstand them by a fair margin.

As if these illiterates have read Dante!

I would be shocked if they had. It struck me as funny though that this guy is using a similar kind of language in this way.

As if these illiterates have read Dante!

It sounds like brave and stunning with knobs (LOL) on.

The male ego is infinitely boundless. We're seeing a fine example of it here.

Absolutely spot on Floral.

Dante describes God in the Paradiso, "enclosed by that which It encloses,"

So like when a Tardis lands inside another Tardis and the second Tardis is also inside the first Tardis...

I don’t s see how anything can be both centred and boundless. A centre is the point equally distant from the boundary, eg the centre of a circle is a point equally distant from the circumference.

This kind of image is used quite often in philosophy and philosophical literature. Dante describes God in the Paradiso, "enclosed by that which It encloses," or Boethius describes the nature of divine intelligence as being the relation of the centre to the circumference.

So, transness is like a divine first principle, seems to be the message.

Empress

”Deborah Frances-White Rolls the dice" with material about her time as a JW and explains the changing language thing with cults rather well.

Doesn’t she think TWAW though? Or has she made the connection?

Maybe one swaps one cult for another? JW is an obvious cult, but the same methods used apply to other groups, organisations and also to individuals. Are some people more susceptible to the demands of cults?

I think the shifts in language indicate amove away from the TWAW mantra, and the associated demand that TWs be allowed access to women only spaces.

The slur ‘truscum’ has been around for some time.

I think transwomens time at the top of the hierarchy within trans communities is coming to an end. They will obviously still rank above plain old cis women, who lack the insightfulness that comes with being trans. But I think the fluids and nonbinaries are taking top spot now.

Florals link harks back to times not all that long ago, when women were not seen as fully human, as we lack the interiority that men have.
This logic is now being used to seperate the trans who have insightful complexity, from the cis chaff who do not.

But the most insightful and complex are the nonbinaries, who now rank above the old binary trans people, who are still complex, but not quite at the level of the fluids and those who are truly capable of nonbinary thinking.

The demands will very soon shift from demanding transwomen be given access to womens spaces, to a demand that all spaces become mixed sex. Unfortunately I think they will have more success with this, as it is already happening.

Furthermore, they can claim enlightenment and transcendence till they are blue in the face, the internal hierarchies still have XY chromosomed people on top.

These men don’t have to make any changes to their bodies, while the women who try to claim nonbinary status usually have double mastectomies. There is an element of a price to pay, perhaps as a kind of proof they need to supply to be granted access to the enlightened class.

The power structures remain the same as they always were.

I also find this turn to a focus on the inner life of individuals very interesting in a wider societal context. We have seen increasing individualism since at lest 1980s when neoliberalism really took off (remember Thatcher and her claim that there is no such thing as society?).

We areliving through a time where there isn’t much left to conquer for white middleclass men, colonialism is frowned upon, and white men are not automatically treated as little kings of their own castles anymore. So they look inward, and if you cannot claim superiority by virtue of sex, class and colour anymore, you can try to demand special status by virtue of your superior mental enlightenment.

If material reality doesn’t grant you superiority, create a new hierarchy with you on top. Being white middleclass male still grants you enough power to have a good chance of implementing this.

There is still a chance that those men can succeed with the arguments that cis people lack interiority, where ‘cis’ will very quickly just mean ‘women’. After all, making the whole world gender neutral and abolishing refernces to biological sex, doesn’t impcat men the way itdoes women, so men could musch more easily adopt the ‘nonbinary’ lable. They don’t even have to have any surgery.

And because of the magnificence of those blessed with transness, their knowledge of what it means to be female is superior to that of the mere females who have experienced it from birth.

Yes and we know this is exactly what they believe because whenver a transwoman and a woman clash on what it means to be a woman, it's the woman who must give way, who must submit.

But since I've just written an essay I'll bore you with my theories on that another time.

Bore away. That is to say, your essay wasn't boring at all. It was interesting and informative. Please do go on.

This all makes sense in the context of my own ROGD daughter - now a physically transitioning 'gay man' who for the past year has refused to see or be in contact with us.

Her mantra is: I don't need you to understand, just accept.

I persevered with reading all of this article and felt quite ill afterwards because it reminded me of the gaslighting and incredible levels of delusion we were subject to. Which nearly sent me over the edge - because if you actually do try to understand you literally send yourself mad. Nothing can make it make sense.

This ideology actively does NOT want anyone to understand. The whole unstable tower will simply collapse if logic, reason and critical analysis is applied by enough people.

The tone of this piece is so shite - offensive and deeply unpleasant. I should laugh at it but unfortunately this ludicrous non-sensical drivel is brainwashing vulnerable young people and dismantling them body, mind and soul.

Yes, that's right, please remember that trans people are so very much more complex and beautiful than 'cis' people, and the most important thing that cis people can do is centre transness in everything

Thank fuck you translated, i read the first three words and nearly lost the will to live

They also collect shiny, successful analogies like magpies. 'It is like gay marriage' is one that seems to have been pushed to the back of the nest and forgotten about with a few others.

It is no surprise that philosophical arguments are similar.