Jezebel.com lumps GC feminists in with the alt-right

Really interesting and eloquent posts to be found in this thread so thanks.

I would suggest a good read of the FWR archives where all your questions are dealt with.

8th Rule of Misogyny:

Women are whatever men say they are and men are whatever men say they are.

I still miss TheBewilderness...

A woman is an adult human female. So no, it isn't subjective.

What you are saying. It doesn’t make sense.

Who is misogynistic? Or what ?

I was replying to ereshkgirl

What are you confused about?

No spag I don’t know what you are trying to say 🤷‍♀️

‘someone replied with’ that should say.

Sorry? Are you reading the same thread I am?

The original post was

The same applies to the experience of being a woman, or of being trans. People will have different things to say about what it means[..... ]we can never know These things.

With

of course we can. Being a woman isn’t subjective

Say what now ?

No one suggested they did. Straw man.

Physically being a woman is a matter of fact and biology, what is subjective is our personal experiences and feelings towards our sex and the way we adjust our lives accordingly.
Woman don’t all experience ‘being a woman’ in the same way. To suggest we do is misogynistic as well as ridiculous.

Being a woman isn't subjective.

However much some men would like it to be.

Being a woman isn't subjective.

However much some men would like it to be.

What intrigues me a lot Is the black and white thinking of ‘XX female, XY male’ obviously biologically this is 100% correct. Men cannot ‘become’ a biological woman and visa versa.
However, I’ve always believed we do not know or access enough of our brains to truly understand underlying differences.
Our chromosomes make up who we are and sex is decided in utero but as a species we are not perfect and differences and mistakes occur at birth all the time.. woman are born without vaginas(biological), babies are born with 6 fingers or organs on the outside. There are many disorders that cannot be explained or seen, how can you be so sure that transgender people are not suffering from a hidden malfunction at birth of being born with the mismatched reproductive organs and chromosomes?
Going back not that long ago, homosexuality would’ve been seen as a ‘wrong choice’ made by someone, I think people found it hard to understand the whole ‘Adam and steve’ concept when they themselves did not feel it and all their lives had been told man+ woman is the way to go, because biologically were supposed to be programmed to reproduce and homosexuality did not fit in with what was ‘supposed’ to happen.
I think there was a study recently that said trans brains align more closely to that of their desired sex.
Everything is open to exploitation obviously, and self-ID does blow that wide open, but I find it interesting that people are so sure of themselves that man=man and there’s nothing else too it?
I’m interested in thoughts.

Being a woman isn't subjective.

Exactly. XX chromsomes, clitoris, human female.

The idea that woman / female could be reduced to somebody's feeling is not just misogynist, it's homophobic because it negates the concept of same-sex attraction.

Of course we can. Being a woman isn't subjective.

This. And all the fluffy pomo nonsense in the world doesn't change that.

Woman: an adult human female
Female: of or denoting the sex that can produce ova

I mean, if these are the people you want to hang out with, fine. But have you tried engaging your brain and actually thinking about the arguments instead? It's hard work, but ultimately rewarding

You talk about ‘engaging your mind’ yet have used my comment about GC feminists being happy to align with the right and ignored it, instead choosing to mention various (awful) TRAs... there’s not much critical thinking or brain function going on there.

The minute GC people chose to put their issues with a minority of men over the issues of a majority of woman, the movement did lose a lot of credibility imo. Listing people who are TRAs and bad just makes you appear childlike ‘they’re bad too!’

As I mentioned, it’s not the fact that Posie went to America and spoke to these people, it was the fact that most GC people openly defended and made excuses for it.

Feminism is about the liberation of woman, the conservative right aim to do the opposite. How can a feminist movement align with such anti-female organisations and be ok with that?

We can never know these things.

Of course we can. Being a woman isn't subjective.

What I don't get is why we try to codify complex states that are going to need to be derived from the commonality of experience across a wide range of experiences.

There's a huge difference between my experience of life and language as an English speaker, and a foreigners experience of life and language speaking something else. I don't understand the bizarre impulse in modern science to look at something like that and try to learn.

If two people say two different things, then they're different. Trying to construct a similarity or derive shared experience from that is obviously disingenuous.

The same applies to the experience of being a woman, or of being trans. People will have different things to say about what it means, so they're obviously lying and there's nothing more to learn.

Imagine a doctor took this approach, asking patients to rate their pain despite people having different pain thresholds, and then saying "okay this condition is more painful than this other condition" even though the patients all say completely different things to one another. It's just irrational. We can never know these things.

Likewise transwomen are women. It's an astonishingly nonsensical thing to say, when you can't define the most important word in the sentence. But everyone else can. Except the definition doesn't work in your sentence. And you go off alarming. But won't define it yourself.

Precisely. As soon as you demand a definition of "women" in that sentence the whole thing collapses.

If no one can explain what gender identity is, or when they do, it differs in every aspect from the next person who has it, or the person who doesn't have one, or the person who has several, then It really is just them.

Yep.

Is that the true meaning of con ?

Absolutely.

If no one can explain what gender identity is, or when they do, it differs in every aspect from the next person who has it, or the person who doesn't have one, or the person who has several, then It really is just them.

Likewise transwomen are women. It's an astonishingly nonsensical thing to say, when you can't define the most important word in the sentence. But everyone else can. Except the definition doesn't work in your sentence. And you go off alarming. But won't define it yourself.

Lots of words are used to describe this, but I keep coming back to unutterably childish nonsense. Because, it's exactly the way children talk.

So yeah datun it’s all just a big confidence trick.

Is that the true meaning of con ?