Toilets at childs school

From previous loo-related threads (mostly UK-based but might be relevant):

'Privacy is also considered a human right, one of the most basic in fact, which is why international human rights law specifies that we must have single-sex provisions in circumstances where we are vulnerable and why the Equality Act recognises the specific sex-based needs of females.'

'Perhaps raise the risk of toxic shock syndrome if girls are reluctant to change their tampons - especially on lighter days, or on bad ones the temptation to put another one in. 8 hours is reachable if going from 8am to 4pm away from home or a private toilet.'

'UTIs are a painful health condition which predominantly affect little girls because the urethra in female people is nearer the bum as a source of urinary tract infection. UTIs increase frequency and urgency of needing to go. UTIs are also very painful. UTIs are exacerbated and UTIs can be started by withholding toileting.' (NHS Choices info www.nhs.uk/conditions/urinary-tract-infections-utis-in-children/)

And one where the pupils got together to get the policy changed: www.thetimes.co.uk/article/genderneutral-toilets-my-daughter-was-called-selfish-for-wanting-girlsonly-loos-at-school-cwth60b2c

Good luck!

Good luck.

@LL83V - And for building resilience i would teach dd to wipe the seat with a thick bit of loo roll, hover then thoroughly wash hands as I have rarely been to a female public toilet where I haven't had to wipe the seat. Cleaning staff use personal protective clothing to clean up bodily fluid, it's not up to CHILDREN to clean up after other children. No way would I advocate that my child cleans up after anyone else.

Awful situation. I feel so bad for all of the kids in this situation.

"male urine smells different to female urine"

Yes it does. I worked my way through university as a cleaner, I’m here to tell you that male toilets smell very different from female toilets.

Male toilets don't only have more pee all over. There will also be faeces ... up to a height of 5 feet up the wall. I don't even understand how they manage to do that. When I was a cleaning lady at a hospital in my ill spent youth, I would start off cleaning the male toilets by pouring a couple of buckets of water over the walls. I thought this was necessary because it was a hospital and some of the men were patients and blah blah. However, later when I worked at an office, we had crafts men coming in who just used what ever toilet was nearest regarding whether it was a male or a female toilet and they would leave poop on the seats, refrain from flushing, stink the place up. In the end they weren't even allowed to use the male toilets. They had to bring in porter potties. I just don't understand, how someone can be so shameless.

Not sure what regulations exist in Australia, but in the UK they're clear: over 8 years old and you must have single sex toilets AND wash basins.

Here's some research from a small women's group in Wales highlighting downsides of mixed sex toilet blocks to girls:

www.walesonline.co.uk/news/education/pupils-missing-school-because-dont-15839558

Male piss smells worse. Fact.

Same for all mammals.

LL83

Totally agree with this one. Male entitlement to making a mess and not cleaning up after themselves is learnt behaviour. And, for the record I also agree that there are lots of boys and men who do act responsibly in this way.

I think the issue is people, especially boys have to be taught to use the toilet correctly, it isn't fair on the cleaner (Male or female) either. Or the clean boys who have to pee in there.

Countess

the girls have suddenly started passing on the floor Hahaha! I thought you were referring to my suggestion of a dirty protest getting the job done!

LL83

Believe us it's a girls v boys issue. I've cleaned a lot of public toilets over the years and I can tell you that the men's is repetitively piss soaked (how/why do they get it EVERYWHERE?) and the women's is usually a breeze to clean.

Damn you prudish autocorrect - pissing on the floor.

Of course she knows it's the boys. If previously clean toilets start smelling when they are turned unisex, what is more likely, that the girls have suddenly started passing on the floor or that it's boys?

But it is not a girls v boys issue. There will be clean boys there too and they likely dont enjoy the dirty toilets either.

If you want to argue for girls only toilet reason would be private space. Not boys are dirty. Likely is more often boys who make the mess but you dont know that.

Most school toilets are not nice. Toilets at my school were filthy and it was single sex toilet so no boys there.

Not seriously suggesting this but a dirty protest might get their attention quicker and more effectively than written complaints

I agree with BlackeyedGruesome. Take it further to get a response. Involve health services. A letter from your gp warning the school about the likely affects sustained dehydration would have on their patient. Get the papers involved. Quote the UN. Give them a lesson on the history of women only loos.

We need a revival of the Ladies Sanitary Association which was set up in 1850 to campaign for public toilets for Women. These unisex toilets have set us back nearly 200 years! F*cking idiots.

"male urine smells different to female urine"

OP, Untameable shrews in Aus might be able to point you to some feminist legal resources that you can use? UK sources will be based around UK and EU law but you may have some Australian legal points that you can make to your school if there is sex discrimination.

Maybe the girls should take up the teachers offer of using the staff toilets - every day the whole female student population queuing up outside the staff toilets!
But yes, my daughter would be the same and just avoid using the toilets at all.
Maybe suggest they spread the word about complaining - they each complain once a month - if all the girls did that there would still be around 10 complaints a day.

patch.com/virginia/ashburn/bp--dehydration-its-impact-on-learning

I'd be concerned about dehydration - avoiding fluids so to avoid having to go to the loo in a hot country must have an impact. Are there any studies looking at the links between learning/concentration and dehydration? I'll look it up.

And yes male urine smells different to female urine so you can tell which sex if responsible but I would want to clean up anyone else's wee in order to have one myself, in my own home or in a school or public toilet.

Hahaha raise your daughter to be a proper woman by teaching her it's her job to clean up male piss 😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂🙄

Can you go and talk to the school principal in person? Much harder to ignore you if you're right in front of them.

You could get together with the parents of your daughter's friends and all go and talk to the principal together.

Does the school have governers like UK schools? If so, contact them as well.

If the toilets aren't clean I would complain. I wouldn't mention 'male urine' as it is impossible to tell who pee'd on the seat.

The solution may end up being separate toilets, but I wouldn't start there if the problem is the toilets aren't clean. I would expect them all to be reminded about wiping the seats perhaps posters or whatever.

Also has your dd checked the toilets every day? Possibly someone is being dramatic and they are all getting carried away.

And for building resilience i would teach dd to wipe the seat with a thick bit of loo roll, hover then thoroughly wash hands as I have rarely been to a female public toilet where I haven't had to wipe the seat.