Advice on raising a daughter

If your wife is looking strained when you get in, take your daughter and try to get your wife to do something for herself

DH used to say that he could tell what kind of day I'd had from the state of the kitchen. If it looked like a bomb had hit it, he would start clearing up immediately and take DD as well. Our marriage has fared better than a lot of my friends. For some reason...

OP I think you are gonna be a great Dad. You're questioning received wisdom re parenting roles and you're addressing gaps in your knowledge/attitudes.
Don't listen to negative posts. The fact that you're willing to think seriously and make the effort to be a good father to a daughter is what matters.
How many men actively think about their role as parent to a girl? Very few would be my guess. I think it's great that you're pondering your responsibilities.
Your daughter will be a unique individual as every child is. Be present. Be approachable.
Try to actively listen.
Show her that her mum and dad are a team, that you respect her mum....both of you are equally available to her and responsible for her.
Model the kind of man that you would be happy for her to be with when she grows up.
Congratulations on your impending fatherhood.

Ask for flexible work arrangements, and then talk about them at work--don't let it be under the radar.

And a piece of very personal advice: when she is tiny, pee before you leave work. We had a non-sleeper, so I was trapped all day with a cranky awake baby and couldn't do anything by myself, and it nearly broke my marriage that when my DH got in he would go straight to the loo for a wee by himself. If your wife is looking strained when you get in, take your daughter and try to get your wife to do something for herself, rather than around the house. Your daughter needs to grow up seeing her mum look after herself as well as everyone else.

Find stuff out about women. The boys at my DD's school spend their time saying, "girls can't be spies/ninjas/inventors/astronauts" You should be able to say "what about Noor Inayat Khan/Tomoe Gozen/Stephanie Kwolek/Helen Sharman?" as easily as you can name men with those jobs. The fact that most people can't is because women's roles aren't valued. If you don't know, find out with her. I normally say, "of course there were female Viking warriors, let's go look". And by the way, why do boys from 5 years old tell the girls there aren't female spies/ninjas/inventors/astronauts? Interestingly, when there's a traditionally female role the famous in that field are almost always still men (Gordon Ramsey, Doctor Spock, Karl Lagerfeld). So boys know they can be astronauts or cooks but girls don't.

And try to refer to everything as men's and women's or nothing. So either the World Cup when the women are playing or the men, or the Women's World Cup and the Men's World Cup. Never the World Cup and the Women's World Cup. ''Men's" isn't default.

The best thing DH did was deal with sick. When your DD knows you will stay up with her when she's throwing up and you will clean up, comfort her and make the world OK again, she will remember that.

I personally don't like young girls being referred to as princesses, wearing all girly defined clothes, all the time. Nothing wrong with moderation.
Buy her bricks and science stuff, encourage puzzles.
Don't treat her differently because she's a girl. I found this easy I must admit as had 2ds first.
Take her to all the places you'd take a boy, encourage her to be who she wants to be.

@FatherWantingAdvice asking me to tell you what the mental load is is quite a good illustration of what the mental load is. You have access to the internet and google so could have just googled it yourself. But here’s a link www.workingmother.com/this-comic-perfectly-explains-mental-load-working-mothers-bear#page-9

Things like when immunisation are due, what size nappies, what’s for dinner, how to wash clothes, etc etc, when enrolments are due, presents for birthday parties, packing for holidays, making sure clothes are clean for holidays and on and on.

Basically don’t expect your wife to tell you want needs doing.

Echoing everyone who has basically said that what you show her will matter way more than what you say. Things that I see dads do which I love in this respect are:

1. Sharing the chores and the mental load equally (mental load as in seeing what general life admin needs doing and just doing it, inc a lot of shit that culturally gets lumped on women - we tend to take the flak if family birthday cards/presents aren't bought, kids forget stuff for school etc.)

1. Talking about feelings - kids and ours - a lot. Talking about patriarchy and how it forces roles on men and women that it is fine and advisable to reject.

1. Asking about opinions, goals, interests. Saying 'you are beautiful' regularly but also 'you are clever '; 'you are funny' ; 'you are perfect and never making negative comments about appearance.

1. Keeping in mind that he is the role model of the future partner they will have (if straight) and that the above is exactly how they would want their daughter to be treated: with respect, love and the support of an emotionally literate partner.

We have a son and my husband does all this - I think it's equally important for both sexes. I love that my son's role model is an emotionally literate, caring and loving man who contributes equally at home. If we have a daughter, I'll be glad of it too.

Thank you for posting here - parents are pressured into gendering their kids so young these days which I'm sure has contributed to the current ideas arou d 'feeling male/female' if you don't fit those narrow roles. Porn culture has forced toxic masculinity on boys, internalised self-hatred on girls and awful expectations of sex and relationships on both. Men breaking this down is a welcome thing. Conhratulations and good luck

Please don't ever tell her off for being bossy if you wouldn't use the same word for a little boy.

I said mostly, not exclusively analysis and news reporting Jurgen. So obviously advice features too. I don't know why you're being so argumentative. It seems pretty pointless.

Erythronium, top thread on FWR right now;

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3571868-first-period-advice

There's that word 'Advice' again. I guess Lettera just hasn't got to that one yet. 'Just buy her some tampons ffs and stop posting' is my first guess.

And my comment about my wife still not being over it? I included my wife's feeling too. What does that say about her? Stop being so one-eyed.

Equally revealing, I thought, was your comment that the proof your daughter found a relationship as good as yours was that she went out with a man you'd have been happy for her to stay with.

Women actually come on here and ask which books are useful or worth reading. Why would they be turned away?

The comparison wouldn't be a woman asking advice from a feminist, although what goes on here is mostly news reporting and analysis, not advice. The comparison would be a white person rolling up to an anti-racism board and asking people of colour advice on how not to be a racist. I've never done that either and never would. Male entitlement often means that men expect women to do the work for them and for them to get cookies for even the most cursory nod to feminism (e.g. offers of marriage). That may not be what is going on here, but it's worth bearing in mind that it can happen.

As was your post. The person directly after you made the same point. What does that reveal about her?

In all my years lurking on here, I've never once seen a woman turned away with 'go and read the manual'. Never ever. It's always, quite rightly, welcome to the club.

And what if his wife is a handmaiden, or whatever you call them? Or someone not aware of feminism, as so many women aren't? And you never once asked advice of another feminist? Really? That is most of what this board is!

Wow, Jurgen, just seen how you interpreted my post!

Very revealing!

The first reply wasn't rude, Jurgen, it certainly wasn't "fuck you". It's quite reasonable to ask a man why he's not talking to the woman closest to him about bringing up his daughter rather than a bunch of strangers on an internet board. When I became a feminist I don't remember ever making demands on other women to do my work for me, I read around feminism, thought about it and paid attention to the world around me.

Ordinary average men are users of porn. It's incredibly common. There simply isn't a way of telling which man does and which man doesn't, especially not from reading a few posts on an internet board. A PP has already said she was exposed to porn through seeing her father's search history. That isn't uncommon either, which is why children need protecting by men (fathers in this case) not using pornography.

Why not add 'don't do hard drugs' to the list as well?

Because unlike hard drugs, pornography is the sexual subordination of women by men. It broadcasts and reinforces misogyny to any man who uses it and it is deeply harmful to women and girls. This man is asking advice about bringing up his daughter. Not taking part in misogynistic practices would rate pretty high on that list wouldn't it?

This is slightly bugging me now OP, but you still haven't actually said you won't use it.

Anyway, my advice as the dad of a daughter completing her university degree. Show her through your own marriage what a good, loving, happy relationship looks like. One of the nicest things she ever said to us was that she hoped she could find a relationship as happy as ours. Almost made me cry. But the proof is that of her one serious relationship, she went out with a man I'd have been happy for her to stay with. He was honest, kind and caring. My wife still hasn't got over them splitting up

Could NOT go on work trips

Father - to reply to your earlier question I think it was me becoming default parent. So it was assumed I would do childcare drop off and pick up which meant I could go on work trips easily or stay late for drinks after work for example. DP got a promotion shortly after DC1 was born which is pretty common i believe. He works pretty flexibly these days so he can do the school run twice a week etc but it’s always been ‘under the radar’ .

True Jurgen.

I'd be surprised if that type of man thought that FWR would be able to teach him anything. I mean, the first response he got was so rude and 'fuck you MAN!', and yet he has persisted and taken a lot of the (very good) advice on board. His actions don't strike me as those of a porn-consuming misogynist. Why not add 'don't do hard drugs' to the list as well?

One of the nicest things I've ever seen someone write about their DH on MN was 'he always has his hands full' - either rocking a baby or carrying a toddler, or that basket of laundry or the loo rolls that need to go upstairs etc etc. Many households, the woman has hands full more of the time than the man.... you can work out for yourself what message that gives the children.

Re porn - it’s being the type of man who thinks porn is ok, views it, thinks the abuse and humiliation of women for sexual gratification is normal. It’s so common now, it’s become normalised, but it’s so extreme. It’s not about viewing it or having it in the house. Of course that’s not appropriate.

Set the bar for her future relationships. You are showing her how relationships work, how men love women and how she can, in turn, expect to be loved. Love her mother, be kind, be thoughtful, treat her how you want your DD to be treated.

And learn to do hair. Seriously. Don’t be that dad who can’t do so much as a ponytail, so a mum needs to step in (and if she happens to dance - learn how to do a ballet bun). Don’t be that dad who waits looking helplessly around for a woman to sort what his daughter needs out.