Work survey asking for 'gender'

I think it is all about context. From a market research perspective, sex based differences may not be particularly important. What matters is whether men (including trans men) and women (including trans women) have different buying patterns. However, sex based information is important, as other posters have said, to identify if there are structural disadvantages based on sex. The problem with asking about sex on its own if you don’t also ask about gender and if people’s gender matches their biological sex is that you have no idea if transgender people have answered the sex question according to their current gender, been offended and not answered, felt unsure about how to reply and left a blank or even answered according to their biological sex. Yes, some surveys are constructed assuming that gender is a more polite alternative than sex but actually an awful lot of testing is done to try and work out what question forms are best. The ‘prefer not to say’ option helps researchers because it reduces the number of blank replies where you do not know for sure why the respondent has not answered the question and gives respondents the option of not sharing personal information. You need to use the Equality Act protected characteristics if the object of the survey is, for example, to measure the extent to which an organisation is meeting its public sector equality duty but there are other times when it is ok to ask about gender. The answer to all this is that nobody will ever devise a survey question that satisfies everyone.

That is very interesting to know NutsToThat. I will bear that in mind.

I take what stopthecavalry says about not adding to the focus on trans too. Good point. I have always assumed that forms or surveys say gender because that's what they are asking for, not as an alternative word for sex, which it obviously isn't.

@Charlie Parley contacting MRS is definitely an option, if they start receiving lots of complaints, that certainly won't hurt our cause.

However the MRS constructed their guidance off the back of reports by EHCR which are primarily concerned that trans people must be presented with survey questions that they're comfortable with (don't get me started!)

When I've got time, I'll try to do a more detailed thread on this.

@YogaDrone under Market Research Society guidelines, as terrible as they are, they must give you the option to say 'other' or 'prefer not to say'. Any survey that forces you to give an answer that is incorrect or makes you uncomfortable is against their regulations and research agencies using such question structure are in breach of the code of conduct

As a pp said most people designing these surveys have given zero thought to the difference between gender and sex. They often think gender is a polite or more modern word for sex. By saying you are non-binary you are giving them more reasons for increasing a focus on trans issues in your organisation.

Another thing I don't get: some people (on youtube for example) describe themself (?) as trans non-binary. As in, both trans and non-binary. If the drop-down box on your company's website only allows you to tick one, you are required to choose not only between male and female, but also between trans and non-binary. In fact, IIRC, you can only choose one of these four options. Tricky.

The problem is that often on online forms the "Gender" question is a required answer. So if there are only two options (male and female) what do you do? I toss a coin.

Where there is an "other" and a free text field I use this to state "none".

Where the question is "do you identify as" and the options are Male, Female or non-binary I have to use non-binary because I don't "identify as" either male or female, I AM female. It's a loaded question isn't it?

I don't yet understand is the rejection of gender.

Gender doesn't really mean anything other than being either a set of stereotypes attributed to you based on sex (and therefore a pile of rubbish) or, as is being increasingly described, a diaphanous concept of 'feeling like something' which is entirely subjective and therefore meaningless in the context of categorisation as there's no objective measure.

I don't have a subjective 'feeling' of identification with a gender (outside of the fact I am female and therefore a woman), and I also don't identify with the stereotypes imposed on me simply because I'm female. (I have aspects of both 'feminine' and 'masculine' in my personality). Therefore if I absolutely have to choose, the closest gender I have is 'gender free'.

Gender doesn't lead to discrimination in the way that sex does and therefore does not generally need to be captured. Gender is the discrimination and I have no intention of identifying into my own oppression by playing along with the idea that all females are a homogenous mass with the same tastes. I'd rather abolish the concept of gender completely so people can just crack on with being who they are. I feel no need to protect it as a concept.

I suspect many organisations have put zero thought at all into the fact that sex and gender are two very different things. I had a discussion with my son's school about this and the head just kept trying to tell me that essentially they were the same thing and 'gender' was just the modern, inclusive, acceptable and non bigoted word for 'sex'. Drove me up the wall that she didn't get what I was saying at all - she's responsible for educating children on the matter fgs!

'Gender' is socially accepted mannerisms or codes of dress that display a persons biological sex.
No one has a 'gender', its made up. If gender existed in biology it would be consistent across all cultures and through time; but it isn't.

Thanks olderthanyouthink. I am very much not a stereotype dresses, pink nails, long hair and make-up woman. I strongly object to the narrative that that's what makes a person's gender female. I think (I'm constructing my opinion still as you can tell), that it's important to me to claim my gender as well as my sex as part of the defense against the extreme stereotyping that is happening and is damaging the gender and the sex. I'm not a certain % less or "other" just because I don't fit into a stereotype box. I'm definitely still fully female.

I wouldn't select non-binary as it will push up the numbers of those who identify as such in the eyes of HR and will eventually work against you. Find a way of communicating that your sex is female - even if only in a free text box at the end of the survey or by separate email.

@lordwheresmyshoes you are absolutely free to want to claim both sex and gender. That is genuinely fine with me. But as why do some others reject it, particularly as it has become entrenched in the last few years, well this is what I wrong on the “work award” thread listed yesterday:

“And tbh I find it quite offensive when I have to answer how I “identify”. I am a woman, my genes irrevocably say so. But I don’t “identify” with the gender stereotypes applied to women which I consider regressive and dislike the idea of being pushed to say I do. “

The rejection of gender is because it's based on stupid stereotypes eg female means dresses and skirts and long hair and make up and pink and sparkles whereas male means jeans and tshirts and short hair and DIY and blue and mud.

Genderfree is being used by Somerville who is applying for a LGBTQ+ award at work (there's a thread with title like that for it)

Me? Have I used the wrong terminology? I'm sorry, I know terminology is important and I'm trying.

Let me try to phrase clearer; it seems like GC people on mumsnet don't want to say their gender is female, only their sex. I get and agree with the important of pointing out sex, what I don't yet understand is the rejection of gender.

DP is applying for a job at the BBC, set me off when he had to ask me how to answer the "are you trans" question... my head nearly exploded at the phrase "gender assigned at birth"

Pretty sure it didn't ask what his sex was just his gender (I think M/F/PNTS).

Where have you seen that?

Somebody tell me why so many GC women are choosing "genderfree" (or whatever) instead of female? To me I'm biological sex female and gender female; claiming my gender as well as my sex feels very important.

Interesting, NutsToThat Should we be talking to the MRS then?

Guidance given by the Market Research Society, who govern research agencies that put together, is very enlightening. Google 'mrs guidance sex and gender', and you'll see what I mean.

Dig further into the references included in that document and you really start to understand why survey questions on this simple demographic attribute have become a nonsense.

In short, any research agency bound by the MRS code of conduct has to follow stupid guidelines or face sanctions. It's insidious and we need to push against it whenever we can

This is the report on the census It explains why keeping the sex question binary is important.

How utterly bizarre that I am typing this in 2019. Science denial 21st century style...

^which means not means which!

Ask them what the purpose is of collecting this data. If it is to monitor equality issues, such as sex discrimination, you could refer to the census which collects sex as one of the most important data points. You could look at the committee report on this from the Scottish Parliament as it has evidence from statisticians on why we need to measure sex.

And as PP suggested, remind them that the protected characteristic is sex and that that is separate from the protected characteristic of gender reassignment means which they are conflating with this question.

You could suggest the inclusion of an additional question if they also want to collect data on trans status and then tell them to include does not apply or gender free for the vast majority of us who don't have a gender identity.

In paper forms I now always cross out sex and put in gender. When it is about the kids, if I ever get challenged on that I will smile and politely tell them that I wouldn't propose to assume my child's gender since there are over 70 of them now but that I know their sex which is the only thing they need to know.

If it's a fixed field online which can't be changed then I would select non-binary too. According to Stonewall it describes me perfectly. Agender or Genderfree is ever better if available.

I've recently had two paper forms to fill in and on these I cross our "Gender" and write "Sex".