Let Toys Be Toys has fallen

Thank fuck my kids have left school, that's all I can say.

I'd be having words with the safeguarding lead if my kids were subject to religious indoctrination like this.

jellyfrizz

You won't get an explanation. You'll get a flounce, though. I guarantee it.

We were having conversations about gender and gender expression in the 70s thank you, and I very much doubt we were the first.

Can you also please explain what you mean by 'identifying as a boy' without reference to stereotype and feelings. If you can do so without resorting to misogynistic insults that would be super.

.The world is changing, whether you like it or not.

And there you have it.

Confused children showing up at gender clinics has increased 4000%.

4000%.

Because places like mermaids are telling children they must pick an identity, either a barbie, or a GI Joe. Utterly regressive. And if their sex doesn't match, they're trans.

And your problem is they're not actually disguising their breasts effectively.

What is wrong with you?

Go back to the 1950s. The women on mumsnet will sort this.

But there are hormonal differences between men and women and sometimes this can explain why some people feel more comfortable expressing themselves as a certain gender.

I'm not following, please could you explain a bit more?

s1naidsucks- you sound hysterical. I am a teacher but I don’t “teach” kids to change genders, I support those who want to. No agenda here other than compassion. The world is changing, whether you like it or not.

Seriously? There are no gender sterotypes? Jamie likes to fix things. Jamie wants to kiss the princess. Jamie wants a short hair cut..... Jamie (female) is really a boy.....

This book is homophobic tripe.

I watched the YouTube video of the book, it wasn’t at all about enforcing gender stereotypes, simply about a girl who felt they were more comfortable identifying as a boy.

Look, I totally get the argument that gender stereotypes exist and I can see how people would argue that there is no such thing as gender except a series of cultural stereotypes assigned to boys and girls. But there are hormonal differences between men and women and sometimes this can explain why some people feel more comfortable expressing themselves as a certain gender.

I have taught children who struggle with their identity. It goes far beyond just wanting short hair and to wear “boy clothes”. It’s a feeling of wanting to be seen and accepted as how they feel inside. I’ve seen students physically hurt themselves by inaccurate breast binding because no one talks about this stuff and they hate their own bodies. Do they need counselling? Most definitely. Do they need to be judged and told they are just confirming to a set of cultural stereotypes? Fuck no. That is harmful and degrading.

God knows I wish we could “abolish gender” and everyone could be free to live, dress and express themselves however they want but that is a huge social change that I don’t think can be solved on Mumsnet. Yet we have the transgender movement to thank for normalising the conversation about gender and gender expression.

Let toys be toys, as far as I understand, was a movement that aimed to remove the stereotypes of “boys toys” and “girls toys” and allow children to explore play however they like.

The book itself seems really positive. There is no toy stereotypes or even gender stereotypes. The main character of Jamie even states that it isn’t the suit or the pumpkin car that makes him feel better, it’s the ability to be himself. I don’t see what the outrage is.

i am speechless! everything on their twitter feed is completely invalidated by their support for that regressive rubbish!

i've worked with children for years from a very wide range of backgrounds. there are loads of sensitive issues that come up. you teach children kindness and tolerance of others with differences. you don't teach the reasons behind those differences as scientific fact!

you teach the children not to tease the little girl for wearing a headscarf, you don't teach them that all women and girls should cover their hair. you explain that so and so can't go to parties on a Saturday because of his faith, you don't tell the kids they all have to observe Sabbath. you teach kids that X has been struggling with an eating disorder and could really do with some time with friends not talking about diets and looks. you don't teach that X is far too fat to be loveable let's help her skip meals.

changing uniform and name - fine - you teach the classmates to try and use the new name and - hell - ALL kids should be able to wear whichever items of the uniform! but teaching children that a classmate has changed sex is dangerous. it is completely disingenuous to think it does not affect every other child in that school. the backstory with all its reinforcement of gender stereotypes and subtle (and not so subtle) homophobia. what message does that tell classmates? especially the gender non conforming ones and the ones who are wondering if they are gay?

this is before you even stop and think about the other messages that might be hidden in the story behind a child who declares they are the opposite sex. what happens to their body that makes them so sure it is wrong? massive massive red flag.

so cross when organisations which have the platform like this choose the cowardly path of no critical thinking skills.

Didn't Let Toys Be Toys start here on mumsnet?

Not surprising that the genderists have targeted it - it goes against all that they stand for.

Sexist toys create sexist minds.

fixed my own post

As a teacher I have seen many children struggle with their gender identity the limiting and damaging sex stereotypes forced on them.

Fixed your post. You're welcome.

I've been a teacher since 2001.

I've not seen any children struggle with their gender identity; I've seen two struggle with the narrow constraints that society puts on children through heavily gendered toys and clothes and colours.

And one I knew at school who wished he was a girl so he could play in the home corner without being bullied.

One child I taught was seen by the Tavistock. No dysphoria. Just 'gender non conforming' (and autistic.) it was an extremely clear progression from liking pink stuff and long hair, to upset he "wasn't allowed" (was at home just not at school- but then made me query why the girls uniforms had to be quite so frilly etc) to being told by an older teen sibling (or their mates) he was clearly born in the wrong body.

All the upset was the stuff. The clothes. The colours being "gendered."

Gendered toys creates gendered minds.

(Literally; girls perform lower in geometry than boys when exposed to less 'boys' toys like construction, Lego etc.)

Was it the women and equalities commission which tweeted a link to pop n olly's awful (and factually incorrect) video about intersex?

I'd be banned for saying what I see in that video, Lang.

Because they haven't thought it through, or aren't willing to.

As a teacher I have seen many children struggle with their gender identity.

No you haven't. Nobody has a gender identity any more than they have a soul. It's a religious belief. I sincerely hope you are not helping to induce dysphoria in children by teaching them that they could be born in the wrong body.

Olly Pike's videos should not be promoted by anybody wishing to be responsible about children. When those with influence do that, they lead parents to believe the Pop'n'Olly YouTube channel is safe for their children. It contains a video encouraging children of primary school age to fill out the GRA consultation using lobby group template answers (Stonewall).

The consultation might well be done but, as a parent, I would be horrified to discover that my kids had been encouraged by anyone to visit a YouTube channel for children that saw nothing wrong with them sending in pre-written answers to a government consultation (an adult activity) with those answers supplied by a highly politicised lobby group.

They never come back do they? Every time I hope for an explanation but it’s never forthcoming

Let toys be toys that should say.

My own tot is taking half of my mind

Let toys be toys fb post 31st March www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3547843-let-toys-be-toys-fb-post-31st-march

^this happened.

This happened yesterday though the post is from 2013.

Ironically it doesn't mention identities and the later transitioning TW author doesn't say "that's how I knew" because of the toy preference.

Datun put it perfectly.

This identity stuff has evolved from queer theory. Queer theory was just theory and not even one everyone took any notice of.

It's become a tangible reality, a cult, just like flat earth theory, (but many truly believe it) but one that's ultimately very damaging to perpetuate for children.

Let tots be toys.

Let children be children.

Especially as in the US liking "soccer" is an innate sign for a boy of being a girl. It's utter nonsense.

Good point! I hadn't thought of that.

What's the issue here? I assume the language of the book is age appropriate. Or do you object to the fact that gender identity is being discussed even with young children?

How would that go? Seriously?

Hallo Hannah, you don't feel like you're a girl?

Why?

Because...???

What could possibly be the answer ?

Its April the first, I hope this isn't an ill judged April fools prank.