Civil Service Trans policy - what can I do?

Or at least, most of us are not fucking psychic. Lib Dem MP Layla Moran apparently can see into people's gendered souls by looking into their eyes, but unfortunately this Marvel-esque superpower has passed most of us by.

This also goes way beyond an employment issue as the Civil Service are obviously going to be used to force this on members of the public as women will have to submit to being searched by genitally intact men who have simply made an effort to look like a woman as:

It would therefore appear that such searches can be conducted if:
 the transsexual person is, for all practical purposes, indistinguishable from a non-transsexual person; OR
 the transsexual person has done everything possible to present as member of their ;new‟ gender; OR
 the transsexual person holds a Gender Recognition Certificate (p32)

This is apparently based on case law as

'This is supported by the judgement in the case of A. vs. Chief Constable of West Yorkshire Police, made in the knowledge of the coming into effect of the Gender Recognition Act. The judgements of Lord Bingham and Baroness Hale concluded that the case did not revolve around the Goodwin case so, by inference, a GenderRecognition Certificate is not necessary to conduct such searches.'

So we only have an inference that this is the case and this would probably only be established if an actual test case was brought. But the question remains what standing does this document have as guidance when it is advising members of staff to threaten members of the public with falling foul of discrimination law if they refuse to be searched by someone they have strong reason to believe is a physically intact male? Is this not state-sanctioned assault? Is there no possible legal challenge to this document as it stands when it is pressuring staff to resort to legal threats?

Oh and

(c) putting us in either of these positions is currently illegal, because changing rooms and single sex services are explicitly exempt from the general provisions of the GRA.

Where is this vitriol?

No one has said that trans people are predators.

What we are saying is
(a) that when, for instance, we emerge from a shower clad in a towel in the communal changing rooms in our workplace (my workplace has these, widely used by women who cycle to work) and are confronted with a naked penis, we cannot tell whether it is attached to someone who identifies as trans, or someone who is a sexual predator. Because we are not fucking psychic. And it is wrong to put us in that position.

and that

(b) TWAW is a statement of belief, not fact. It is morally wrong to impose the consequences of that belief on someone who does not share it, for instance by insisting that a woman who does not believe TWAW acquiesce for example to being bodily searched by someone she perceives to be male. She is entitled to bodily autonomy and the assertion of her own right to privacy regardless of whether you share her beliefs.

agree that’s rubbish guidance, but it isn’t civil service guidance is it? It’s by a group called a:gender which seems to be a network which has, off its own back, produced something rather than that coming from civil service resourcing/similar.

I still think it’s bad but it’s not government policy. Aka hopefully there’s still hope.

This is terrifying. Misogyny encoded into workplace practice.

I'm quite shocked at the comments on here. Mums bringing up children to be respectful and accepting of all walks of life?!!! It's one thing to criticise policy but quite another to show such vitriol towards fellow human beings. On the policy, it is wrong that said policy should seek to make individuals uncomfortable or to make individuals fearful of repercussions, but I'm ex-civil service and know this is what happens. So you need to be canny. The document isn't signed off yet, which suggests there is an avenue to provide comments? I'd ask for clarity on what it specifically means in respect of those paragraphs that concern you where female colleagues might feel uncomfortable in sharing intimate spaces. I suspect I know the answer. I would speak to your union rep too. But, as I say, you need to be canny and not come across as phobic.

Which leads me on to my next point. There are some quite nasty comments on here basically saying that transgender people are somehow sexual predators (to put it politely) and that there are sinister motives for them wanting to use gender specific loos. Get real people. I can't imagine the pain and turmoil these individuals go through to realise their true selves. The rejection from friends and family, the snide comments, nudge nudges and wink winks. They are women (and men) and deserve better than the narrow minded nastiness afforded them on this site.

You have a right to feel uncomfortable without fear of disciplinary action but a part of that feeling might just be because you don't know how to deal with it. There needs to be understanding and compassion on all sides - including the Civil Service (but they're too keen to be seen as 'inclusive' they don't really care that a by-product of that is making people feel excluded). Speak to your union rep for advice. If you're not in the union, then join.

Regarding the details of a:gender Millytant posted - how do you identify as intersex? It is a defined biological condition.

Well, I can answer my own question - you appropriate another group's biological reality and manipulate it for your own ends.

And I am horrified by this policy. What hope do we have influencing MPs if the civil service who have their ear are pushing this shit? The power of those behind this is terrifying.

I hope the journalists pick it up, investigate and give it sunlight.

We're well into thought-police territory here aren't we. So women are expected not just to put up with the flouting of the EA by the government but have to act delighted in order that a bloke's feelings are not upset. This is outrageous. Definitely worth checking what's said about sex as a protected characteristic and trying to find out who decided that the PCs of one group outweigh the PCs of another.

@PhrixPhrox any chance you can post a version of that advice as a stand-alone thread? It has "resource" written all over it.

That's horrifying. So we have to be compliant, acquiescing and smilingly docile in our own oppression and erosion of boundaries?

Yes.

Nothing useful to suggest, sorry, but that’s awful and makes me so angry.

Women being punished for wanting/having boundaries. Women’s feelings criminalised. Women (and girls in schools) being taught - yet again - that we are not entitled to prioritise our own feelings of discomfort or fear, but must always put the delicate sensibilities of a male first.

Not only are we supposed to share our single sex spaces, they demand that we act happy about it too?

I honestly believe this culture is actually evil.

That's what I felt when those awful "if you see someone in the toilets who you think doesn't belong there, don't react, they know better than you" posters came out.

It's deeply oppressive to women and girls. It's making us walk on eggshells and I believe that is deliberate.

I've asked around for advice:-

Approach the union saying that you feel that the employer has created a hostile environment on the grounds of sex. It’s sexual harassment.

Union is duty bound to rep its members. If not then you have a claim against the union for sex discrimination; although don’t go in hard yet.

Are there a good number of you in the union? This is industrial relations territory.

Some women (non employees so not going to be intimidated) could leaflet outside the office and ask others who wish to object via the union to do so. Help will be available from GC sources to create wording for their complaint in the leaflet so it’s difficult for the union to shrug off.

The union has an obligation to keep complaints confidential and also act in best interests of their members. They might not like it but that’s irrelevant. Probably easier (emotionally) to sue the union for discrimination.

Naturally, R0.
Trans = Access All Areas

(will it still reach me with N/C etc???)

Yes it will.

Loving these civil service pseudonyms

Is it at all possible the woman was confusing trans with intersex?

I'm sure any women's network will also include women who are transgender and anyone idenifying as Non-Binary.

@DoxxMeTwice

Civil Servant also here (under obvious name change )

I'm also horrified. Not new to GC thinking on here and Twitter but rarely post because...well...Civil Service as you know 😡

I've been doing some very recent reading on Stonewall and the CS. Very scary.

Anything I can do to help then pm me (will it still reach me with N/C etc???) though I'm unable to put neck on line as personal circumstances mean I really need to keep this job

MP written to. Again.

a:gender
@agendergovuk

We are the network supporting all trans, non binary and intersex staff across Government Departments and Agencies. Friends and Allies welcome.

and

Civil Service LGBT+ Network
@cslgbt

The Civil Service LGBT+ Network helps to create a more diverse, inclusive and equal place to work for lesbian, gay, bisexual and trans civil servants.

Why is trans part of both?

Professor Rosa Freedman's speech at recent 'For Women in Scotland' event which identifies that women's Human Rights legislation is specific to sex:

(extract)
"In 1967 the UN Commission on the Status of Women took the ground-breaking step of adopting the Declaration on the Elimination of Discrimination against Women. That was followed in 1979 by the Convention on the Elimination of All Forms of Discrimination against Women. And an accountability mechanism was created – CEDAW -- to review and implement that Convention in States that signed up to it.
The advancement of women’s rights has continued with further ground-breaking moments. At the same time, despite much focus on ending discrimination and advancing women’s equality, and the increasing focus on violence against women and girls, we remain in a world where women are subjugated in many parts of the world, and denied their fundamental rights both in law and in practice. The fight for women to have specific protections has paved the way for other vulnerable groups to do the same.
The very idea of having specific protections for groups who face particular risk is no longer viewed as undermining the very nature of human rights. Since the creation of specific instruments and mechanisms for women similar steps have been taken for children, persons with disabilities, racial minorities, migrant workers, and others.
There is now clear understanding that the risks faced by members of such groups means that they require specific protection in law and practice. Although of course just because such an understanding exists, and just because States formally accept obligations by ratifying treaties, does not mean that changes on the ground are forthcoming. But it gives those groups tools for lobbying for effective change, which is at the heart of human rights advocacy and work. In international human rights law the word ‘women’ has been defined as referring to biological sex.
This was the definition in various international human rights treaties and discussions, including recently in 1998 in the Rome Statute creating the International Criminal Court where it makes it explicit that the word ‘gender’ refers to the two biological sex classes of male and female

concludes:
None of us has the answers as to what will happen. But what is clear from international human rights law is that women’s rights must be protected, and that the UK has legal obligations to do so. In the UK the relationship between the Gender Recognition Act and the Equality Act is such that it is unclear how sex-segregated exemptions might be retained. Indeed, we already know that many of those exemptions are being ignored in practice despite this violating human rights of women.
What we need is clarity. Clarity in terms of the law. Clarity in terms of definitions. We need proposals for solutions that will uphold the rights of all individuals, including the specific protections afforded in human rights law to vulnerable groups. And we need the UK to remember that it is party to international human rights treaties that require it to protect our sex-based rights."

forwomen.scot/wp-content/uploads/2019/02/Rosa-Freedman-FWS.pdf

twitter thread with links to Prof Freedman's articles & speeches:
twitter.com/GoonerProf/status/1092580370439127040

Does a:gender have a Twitter account?

Oh Yes

See Page 52:

a:gender is the support network for staff in government departments/agencies who have changed or need to change permanently their perceived gender, or who identify as intersex.
Telephone: 0787 614 5411
Email: [email protected]
Website: www.agender.org.uk
Twitter: @agendergovuk
Address:
Vulcan House
Ground Floor Iron
6 Millsands
Sheffield
S3 8NU

So If trans individual in question is one of these "I just wake up in the morning and see how I feel" types with two alternate gender identities, do HR have to agree "a date from which they will use sanitary facilities" every time?! Possibly every day?

Does a:gender have a Twitter account? Time for them to receive a bit of sunlight...

It's chilling that objectors will be offered education by management.

And outrageous that biological women may be searched by biologically intact makes.

It's denying biology again.