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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Was Hatshepsut transgender?

89 replies

ItsAllGoingToBeFine · 22/02/2019 14:01

Just saw this tweet form amnesty:

During #LGBTHistoryMonth we are highlighting notable LGBT+ figures from history. Hatshepsut (1507 BC - 1458 BC) fifth Pharaoh of the 18th Dynasty of Egypt, one of the most successful pharaohs in history. born a woman, used female pronouns but presented herself as a King #LGBTHM19 t.co/H4GWvcj7lg

I have to confess my historical knowledge is massively lacking, but I hadn't heard that before?

OP posts:
Knicknackpaddyflak · 22/02/2019 14:34

Assassinated there are several books by people who for decades have been trying to prove that Elizabeth 1 had an intersex condition, because she messes up their internal sex stereotypes by not having obviously had any sexual partners and being anti marriage.

The trauma of experiencing her father murdering women left right and centre including her mother, the appalling manipulation and fates of women born with royal blood by men who wanted to puppet them to have the throne (all the Grey sisters for a start, Margaret Countess of Salisbury for another) and the slow and horrible death of her sister in the power of the man she married, not being considered a good enough reason for her to want to stay single.

Katvonfelttipeyebrows · 22/02/2019 14:31

Oh FFS
Are they really this thick.

silentcrow · 22/02/2019 14:31

Elizabeth I wouldn't be an attractive grab as she never dressed as a man nor called herself King, despite that speech, as far as I know.

Right, we need a Martina of history to get outraged about this wholesale theft and recasting of women's history, and step up to speak out - any suggestions? Mary Beard?

NotTerfNorCis · 22/02/2019 14:31

To call it trans is missing the point so badly the person doing it has to be hard of thinking.

Or they're wise to what trans ideology actually is: enforcing gender (stereotypes) . A woman takes on a stereotypically male role? She must be a man!

Knicknackpaddyflak · 22/02/2019 14:30

the logic is that any woman who acquired a traditionally male title, in an era when this was usually forbidden for women, must be a transman??

As far as I can make sense of this lunacy, bearing in mind new loops appear on a weekly basis:

Trans WAS defined by body dysphoria - who knows if any historical woman had that or experienced a sense of their gender essence not matching their bodily sex - but now that's all wrong and bad for some reason.

So now it's anyone who thinks they are/chooses to be.

Which is evolving to any female who steps even slightly out of the extremely stereotypical rigid box that seems to be being defined solely by trans people and not women - there was one on FWR the other day saying women didn't swear/talk like that/have views like that so we were all obviously men in denial. So women who at any point put on stereotypical male costume or used a mans name obviously were transmen.

Which by extension means that pretty much the ONLY women left inside the rigid sex stereotypes box is TW, since women hate those stereotypes and very very few follow them in any meaningful way.

Which is why we're being told now that there are women and cis women, and women don't actually exist anyway.

Which is why, when you've reached the end of this convoluted rubbish, you regret having lost the minutes of your life trying to make sense of it, go back to the beginning of the loop which said gender was a Thing, and say no. Women are a biological reality. Gender for women is a hierarchical game at which their job is to lose. So fuck that.

AssassinatedBeauty · 22/02/2019 14:25

I'm surprised there hasn't been a clear claim made on Elizabeth 1st, as she made the speech about having the body of a weak and feeble woman, but the heart and stomach of a king. Surely no clearer sign that she was a transman?

AlwaysTawnyOwl · 22/02/2019 14:24

Just reading a book about her interestingly. She would have have had no choice but to present herself in this way given the context of the time so it’s a particularly daft thing to say.

Knicknackpaddyflak · 22/02/2019 14:23

No. Mulan isn't trans either. Nor is Merida from Brave. Nor George from the Famous Five. Nor the Bronte sisters. Nor George Elliot. Nor Joan of Arc. Nor any other woman who had to use male costume or male names in order to be taken seriously or survive in a patriarchy that didn't let women step out of the social box created for them. To call it trans is missing the point so badly the person doing it has to be hard of thinking.

Rufusthebewilderedreindeer · 22/02/2019 14:20

I find it offensive that the achievements of notable women are being erased and re-categorised as transgender

So do i

TheQueef · 22/02/2019 14:19

Fake gold beard and voracious appetite for her slaves if I remember the tour so not lbtq?

butteryellow · 22/02/2019 14:17

She was the one with the fake golden beard wasn't she?

AssassinatedBeauty · 22/02/2019 14:12

So the logic is that any woman who acquired a traditionally male title, in an era when this was usually forbidden for women, must be a transman??

I find it offensive that the achievements of notable women are being erased and re-categorised as transgender.

In this case it's even more stupid because there was no doubt at all that she was female. So which one of LGBT+ are they claiming her for?

SuperLoudPoppingAction · 22/02/2019 14:05

Somebody predicted this on the thread about the crossdressing surgeon.

She was a godwife wasn't she?
Woman is implied.

ComputerSaysMo · 22/02/2019 14:04

Of course she presented as a King, that was the top job in royal terms and she didn’t want to be second place. See also: Elizabeth I’s refusal to marry.

It’s like history has no context for TRAs, doesn’t it?

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