Drag Syndrome?

It's not really about drag, it's the old long-running issue of the rights of people with LDs to make autonomous decisions vs. the risk of them being exploited. I've always felt uneasy about contestants on the X factor/Britains got talent with obvious learning disabilities, set up to be laughed at. But then, why shouldn't they compete if they want to? Same with Undateables.

Hopefully the men performing in this event have supportive people around them and have had good advice. And I hope the tone of the event is more about celebrating talent than freak show.

Sorry trinity, I wasn’t talking about the drag group just Down syndrome specific groups in general.

It’s a really hard call without knowing exactly how this group operates and who the attendees are.
It could just be a ‘dress up and be fabulous’ which would be fine. Or it could be darker.

In general I don’t have a problem with people with Down syndrome having a drag night but like people have said there would need to be safeguarding in place.

I suppose the point is is it’s not up to us to decide whether there should be a group specifically for people with Down’s syndrome, or not, or how much they have in common, on not. It’s up to the people who go to the group.

My sister has Downs and I worked in a health setting with young people with disabilities (physical and learning). There certainly are groups exclusively for people with Downs, I worked with one young person whose Mum was dead against her going to a ‘Downs’ social group but for this (very articulate) young person it was about identity, her best friend for example had more of a hidden disability so faced very different challenges. She wanted to see and meet people who looked like her.

Thanks for posting this OP, it’s a really interesting debate.

Everyone has their own views on this.
One of my children (little boy) has Down's and I just see him as an individual.
I personally wouldn't place him in a group that was solely for people with Down's but that's just how I feel and I appreciate others may feel differently.
He's a little boy with his own personality, his own likes and dislikes.
Down's is just a very small part of him. It doesn't define him.

What needs does someone with DS have that others with a similiar learning disability doesn't?

Well they all have Down’s Syndrome.
I’m sure that there’s groups where they can be with people of a similar learning disability but I certainly don’t see anything sinister about having a group just for people with Downs Syndrome.

Yes for ASD and Deaf people, they have specific needs. What needs does someone with DS have that others with a similiar learning disability doesn't?

One further thong that makes this sinister as far as I'm concerned is that it is just for people with DS. No other group would ever do this, groups and activities are always open to others with similiar cognitive impairments

That’s not true. I know of a youth group for people with Down syndrome and lots of groups exist for specific people. There are groups for people with autism and deaf people and loads of others.

One further thong that makes this sinister as far as I'm concerned is that it is just for people with DS. No other group would ever do this, groups and activities are always open to others with similiar cognitive impairments.

I have had another thought:

If it is (rightly) unacceptable for white guys (oppressor class) to black up for a party or Othello and that, why should it be acceptable for men (oppressor class) to pretend to be women on stage? Often in a hyper sexualised, hyper feminine or otherwise goady way?

Surely one is racist and the other sexist?

And if you agree, then surely THAT'S why young or vulnerable people shouldn't be getting involved with the drag - because it's sexist. And a child or perhaps someone with DS can't be expected to understand that aspect.

It's making sexism fun, I get that.

Please don't anyone think I'm some sort of killjoy fuddy duddy. Sarcasm emoji.

Calvinsmam, so you think they do have a good understanding of the ideology they are representing? They know what identity and gender ideology is? Or understand the place of drag in gay culture?

Why wouldn’t they? It’s not particulary complicated. They probably haven’t got a phd in the subject but neither have lots of people.

Unless you have an objection to drag itself (which is fair enough) you can’t make any sweeping generalisations about whether it is exploitative to include adults with Down’s syndrome. People with Downs are as individual as anyone else, some will absolutely have capacity to understand the history and meaning of drag and choose to participate fully, some may understand it but recoil at the mere thought of glitter and dancing. Some may love glitter and dancing but might not have the cognitive ability to understand what drag is all about. If those that have taken part are safe and happy (not just with their own participation but with the branding, publicity etc) then so be it.

The guy with Downs Syndrome that I know best is a wildly camp person, so I guess that’s influencing my judgement. He would LOVE this. If the participants were recruited from a dance/drama group for people with learning disabilities they are probably all having a ball.

But given the recent skeeviness with drag culture and kids, and the presence of unsavoury types like Alabanza on this project.. I can see why your alarm bells are going off, OP. And drag culture walks some uneasy lines by its nature and it’s steeped in rather malicious humour... it’s easy to imagine these performances taking on an edge of exploitation where the performers are made into a joke. I’m sure this event is OK and good fun for all concerned, but if this became A Thing that happens regularly, it could go sour quickly.

Isn't "drag" taking the piss out of women?

I'm uncomfortable with it because it seems to be a one way street - where are the women who dress up in an exaggeratedly masculine way for the amusement of audiences? It's pretty non-existent compared to things like Rupaul on prime time telly and that. French and Saunders were quite funny with their depiction of the oppressor class. But that's the only exception I can think of.

It's panto season still, yeah?

...(oh yes it is!)

They called it Extra Chromosome Drag Night. Ugh.

Calvinsmam, so you think they do have a good understanding of the ideology they are representing? They know what identity and gender ideology is? Or understand the place of drag in gay culture?

a culture they have little understanding of

Wow. That’s so patronising.

Yes they are being used and abused in order to promote a culture they have little understanding of.

I mean one of the guys with Downs, not the organisers!