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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Women Stand Up in Washington, D.C.

167 replies

GrinitchSpinach · 26/01/2019 21:38

The board is, ahem, moving fast today, and some marvelous stuff is getting buried in the monster threads. I thought this might be a good place to collect reports from on the ground in D.C.

Thanks to SpartacusAutisticus for posting Natasha Chart's wonderful, raw speech outside Human Rights Campaign:
www.facebook.com/100003299679086/posts/2366913433428623/

Here is the protest outside Twitter:
m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=2366769483443018&id=100003299679086&refsrc=http%3A%2F%2Ft.co%2FD8guU5XQ0R&_rdr

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womanformallyknownaswoman · 29/01/2019 16:52

Sounds like a great deal has been achieved and appreciate everyone's input and effort

LangCleg · 29/01/2019 15:50

I love this thread. That is all.

GrinitchSpinach · 29/01/2019 15:47

(Just to clarify that about 2020: I want Democrats to WIN in 2020 and will work hard for that outcome. I just want them to dump the female erasure bullshit well before 2020).

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GrinitchSpinach · 29/01/2019 15:45

Meanwhile, Julia Long and Posie Parker have been meeting with Congressional staff to discuss the women's concerns about the proposed changes to the GRA in the UK, and the parallels to women's concerns about the Equality Act in the US:

m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=2369345473185419&id=100003299679086&refsrc=http%3A%2F%2Ft.co%2FBHQHEip7X3&_rdr

This is wonderful news. American parents of ROGD daughters; lesbians; feminists have gotten nowhere with getting elected representatives to listen to their concerns. I am so glad someone is finally listening!

I sincerely hope that representatives and Senators will take this opportunity to think through the implications of the "gender identity" language in the Equality Act and revise it before it becomes the mother of all wedge issues in 2020.

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GrinitchSpinach · 29/01/2019 15:31

Oh God Andy you weren't here overnight then. The less said about that person the better.

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andyoldlabour · 29/01/2019 15:14

I found this on Aimee Challenor's twitter feed, and If I am right then it looks as though a trans ally called Liz was at the meeting. Some hilarious comments.

twitter.com/glitchliz/status/1089617932844453890

heresyandwitchcraft · 29/01/2019 14:51

Thank you so much for this thread, and to all the women standing up. The speeches and actions are so valuable and inspiring. These women are fantastically brave. I am grateful for every action, large and small. Flowers

GrinitchSpinach · 29/01/2019 14:38

And yet, telling a child they’re perfect as they are...they’re not in the wrong body, they’re just fine as they are, is transphobic.

Not just transphobic, but literally illegal for therapists to do in 15 states and counting. Madness indeed.

This is an international issue...We need to work together.
I agree completely. The genderists sure do so.

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Bowlofbabelfish · 29/01/2019 14:31

feminists rejecting both of those notions and wanting everyone to grow and thrive just as they are-

So true. And yet, telling a child they’re perfect as they are, they’re not wrong, not wrong if they’re gay, or straight, or don’t fit into a neat box, they’re not in the wrong body, they’re just fine as they are, is transphobic. But pushing them down a path of medicalisation, hormones and surgery, and denying their future sexuall preference and ability is fine.

Madness. Utter madness.

Needmoresleep · 29/01/2019 12:18

Grin...way to go!

And thanks to you and other American posters for helping us understand your context. This is an international issue. The money is international, the thinking (medical and academic) is international, organisations (IOC etc) are intermational, the internet is international. We need to work together.

GrinitchSpinach · 29/01/2019 12:09

Bowl, Hacsi Horvath highlighted the loss to follow up numbers but it didn't get further discussion. I agree it's a point that needs amplifying. Politicians in particular, who have been lobbied by pressure groups and repeat the statistics supplied blithely, need to understand how shoddy those numbers are. Journalists too.

Unfortunately the vast majority of journalists and politicians are not very scientifically or mathematically literate. There are a few.

Thanks to everyone who read this thread. With all the nonsense going on right now, I thought it was important to look at what these people are actually doing and saying, or not doing and saying.

In particular I thought Julia Beck's comments when she spokeat the Heritage Foundation!of conservatives trying to mold people's personalities to fit their bodies, and liberals doing the opposite, but feminists rejecting both of those notions and wanting everyone to grow and thrive just as they are--such an act of political courage and such good evidence that merely accepting a speaking venue at Heritage does not make her or any of the other panelists somehow compromised by or beholden to conservatives.

I'd like to thank the poo-slingers and agitators who keep plopping on this board this week. Up until now I've been reading with increasing horror, commenting online, but not done much concrete action to protect the rights of women and girls. Will be making some donations today and reaching out to women in real life this week. Cheers!

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Danaquestionseverything · 29/01/2019 03:56

I've just watched this. The letters from the mum's made me angry and Julia Beck made me cry. Hold the line.

Bowlofbabelfish · 29/01/2019 01:28

Thanks!

I just wondered if it was something the panel were talking about?

Datun · 28/01/2019 23:53

GrinitchSpinach

Wow thank you. You star.

GrinitchSpinach · 28/01/2019 21:37

Links to further contributions from some of the panelists:

Julia Beck's piece, "How I Became the Most Hated Lesbian in Baltimore"

www.afterellen.com/general-news/568221-how-i-became-the-most-hated-lesbian-in-baltimore

Hacsi Horvath, "The Theatre of the Body: A De-transitioned Epidemiologist Examines Suicidality, Affirmation, and Transgender Identity"

4thwavenow.com/tag/hacsi-horvath/

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Qcng · 28/01/2019 20:08

Grinitchspinache
Thanks so much for your work transcribing all of this.
I have the YouTube linknoen in another tab but don't know when i'll get time to watch the 80+ minutes of it.

I was completely unaware of the proposed legal changes in the USA. It's terrifying.

AnneHutchinson · 28/01/2019 19:03

It is staggering what genderism subverts:

Free speech and free thought.
Scientific literacy amongst the populace
Evidence-based medicine
The very rationale for legally protected classes, ie: immutability
Common language, ie shared communication
The understanding that material reality exists a priori to idea
Class-based politics
Women’s rights and women’s participation in public and political life
Gay and lesbian rights
Children’s rights
The rights of the disabled
Patients rights against experimentation

Just wait until transracialism, next up on the agenda, gets going.

It is complete atomization, all the way down, beneath a totalitarian diktat over the right to one’s own perceptions.

GrinitchSpinach · 28/01/2019 18:41

Bowl thanks for weighing in! You have such a valuable perspective to share.
I don't quite understand this tho:
Is this in the agenda? Because it’s incredibly important
The trans agenda or the panel's agenda? Sorry to be dense!

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GrinitchSpinach · 28/01/2019 18:27

Tacky thanks for the Posie link; that was moving.

OvaHere I hope there will be some media coverage but my hopes are not high. I looked for anything about the Facebook, Twitter, HRC protests Saturday and the DC library event yesterday but haven't found anything.

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BettyFloop · 28/01/2019 18:22

That was excellent.
I don't know what the Heritage Foundation stand for or how much power and influence they have (will read up later) but it seems to me that hosting this event was a brave thing to do. The speakers were fab.

GrinitchSpinach · 28/01/2019 18:17

Standing ovation from the crowd! Wow!

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GrinitchSpinach · 28/01/2019 18:17

Question: Is there a possibility of alliance?

KD: That's the intention behind Hands Across the Aisle

JB: We need men on our team!

HH: Women have been in the lead, done 99% so far. Men are picking up on this only slowly.

KD: Trans rights is a men's rights movement.

Ryan Anderson talking about the "Biology Isn't Bigotry" panel last year.

Question: GRA in UK was counterproductive for the trans movement. Is the Equality Act an opportunity to spark a national conversation in USA?

JC: At least in UK you have national journalists speaking out. We do not have that here.

KD: I think that if people understood what the Equality Act would really do, there would be big questions, but it's an open question whether the media will give us a fair hearing.

HH: National media quick to counter any critical articles with a raft of trans responses.

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Bowlofbabelfish · 28/01/2019 18:16

Huge loss of follow up in studies: 30-40%. Where are these patients?If this were an HIV study, that would be considered an emergency level of loss to follow up.

Can I just pick up on this, because clinical trials is something I do know a lot about. She is absolutely correct that that level of either drop out, or loss to follow up if follow up was deemed needed would be something that would not be allowed to pass in the industry I’m in. I can’t tell you the paperwork, scrutiny and focus that would be brought to bear on it.

Once again I am STAGGERED at how evidence based medicine, science, data, decades of careful, experimental work is being pushed aside in favour of opinion.

We are seeing a total reversal of one of the single most positive trends in medicine (making medicine evidence based.) and it’s happening due to lobby group pressure, NOT from any evidence base at all.

Is this in the agenda? Because it’s incredibly important

GrinitchSpinach · 28/01/2019 18:12

Question: 1) Could you give some counsel in this polarized time in our country? Pointers as to how we can facilitate cooperation, put forth a united front? 2) Endocrinologists defer to prof orgs who have changed guidelines dramatically.

HH: Some of them are ideologues. Most doctors are busy and defer to the gung-ho ideologues. For the political questions, I don't play along. I don't say "she." This is gaslighting.

JC: Read 'Galileo's Middle Finger.' Doctors and everyone else are worried we will be attacked, lose friends and family. We have to give cover to each other and make room for questions. More and more people need to speak up.

KD: I have heard from my Republican friends that many conservatives think gender identity ideology is so ridiculous that the Equality Act will never pass. Feminists understand the unbelievable power and money behind the movement to promote gender identity ideology. We need to be prepared for a big fight.

JB: Just meet with people. Talk to your neighbors, talk to your family. Get away from the internet and discuss face to face.

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OvaHere · 28/01/2019 18:07

I really hope this gets traction over there. Are any outlets reporting on it?