Letter in the Times - Plea To The Trans Lobby from group of transsexuals

And what R0 said.

I recall your legal difficulties. I appreciate it's been a shit road for you. And, as I said, the letter was great!

I believe I’m the only transsexual woman who is a qualified (!) lawyer who has expressed support for women objecting against TRA’s and MRA’s. For that I’ve been sent the most disgusting abuse and vitriol and been dragged into the criminal “justice” system

There are those that appreciate what we are trying to do

It was a great letter & an important statement.
I'm aware of what you've done and had to deal with as a consequence of standing up against MTRAs abusive behaviour.
Its not only appreciated but respected.

What this thread revealed was disappointing about some people who are transsexuals. They are individuals.

I apologise if I’ve come across badly, certainly not my intention. I’ve never claimed to speak for women, or how you should be campaigning etc.

Regardless of what people may think, I’m going to continue to provide legal support from the sidelines to those women being harassed or threatened by activists.

It’s all I can do

Sorry, I don’t follow. In what way have I made this about myself. I signed the letter in my real name, which is not on Twitter.

I didn’t join to cause yet another argument. I don’t disagree with the sentiments expressed on this thread.

Perhaps Miranda would kindly confirm my intentions are well meant?

There are those that appreciate what we are trying to do. There are those who will always see us as the enemy

And there are those that do not lump all transpeople into one group.

There are at least two trans posters on this thread that do not set the Male-pattern-abuse red flags waving.

My advice going forward would be not to include people who want to leverage being a signatory to make it all about themselves and, while so doing, minimise everything the letter set out to do.

This ^^

@rowantrees

Yes

@langcleg

Agreed

Boudica10
Have you read the thread?
(Its a bit long but the middle bit can probably be skipped)

As for previous comment, I agree completely. From what I have seen of others I have no faith in the GRC process to protect women, or transsexual women even, from men acting like pricks. That’s before we even get onto the pandora box that is self-ID

Boudica10 - it was a great letter. The shame about all this is not the letter. Thank you for signing it. My advice going forward would be not to include people who want to leverage being a signatory to make it all about themselves and, while so doing, minimise everything the letter set out to do.

I’m not surprised at all, by all means speak to the women that I supported and helped. I never claimed for one second to speak for them.

I believe I’m the only transsexual woman who is a qualified (!) lawyer who has expressed support for women objecting against TRA’s and MRA’s. For that I’ve been sent the most disgusting abuse and vitriol and been dragged into the criminal “justice” system.

There are those that appreciate what we are trying to do. There are those who will always see us as the enemy. C’est la vie, plus ca change.

I absolutely understand that transsexuals are advocating for themselves. that is right and reasonable

just don't be surprised when women do it too please

The intention was to speak out on our concerns. Our own private concerns are not for this forum.

Although deeply disappointing, I has I believe, as Betty comments being an important discussion.

I’m one of the signatories to that letter. We are damned if we do and certainly damned if we don’t. The intention was to speak out on our concerns. Our own private concerns are not for this forum.

This thread should be added to the ‘break it down for me?’ And ‘FAQ’ threads (if it hasn’t already).

It’s a real-time document of what we mean when we say that abusive Male-pattern behaviours don’t spontaneously resolve when a man transitions. Red flags still wave even when they are made out of lace.

This, I thought was a rather apt way to point out a fact, and to try to get us back to what we CAN achieve . Which is a successful campaign against self ID

Its like groundhog day.

You are of course welcome to your opinion Kay but its a bit rich coming on here and lecturimg women (again) on what you think they should focus on. (especially when you are cherry picking quotes)

You've skipped over a very important account of a woman needing refuge services following male pattern abuse and control & how she has been treated by those advocating for trans-rights.

At the end she concludes :
The posturing, the sneering, the intimidation.

Do you know what it reminds me of? 10 years of hell. 10 years of belittling, gaslighting, humiliation, threats. I won’t give the info on the physical stuff, that’s mine.

Pure male misogyny, violence, hatred of women. And all this from people who say they feel like me...a woman"

To repeat Hamsters point,
It's never been JUST about the toilets and if you don't "get" that then you're utterly missing the point, and frankly being self-centred.

Its not all about you Kay
Please stop trying to control discussion of serious concerns about safeguarding & women's safety, dignity & privacy.

Women recognise male pattern attempts at control, especially when they have experienced them first hand.
And a lot of women have.

I think you are very articulate!

Sorry Lang, but I wasn't going to contribute further to this thread after Miranda's posts - which were much more articulate than I could possibly convey - but I saw that comment and couldn't let it lie.

I'll go back into "lurk mode" again now

Kay
Your moral compass is your moral compass, and you're right that no-one else can do anything about that.
To quote Frasier (which I do a lot) "ethics are what we do when no-one else is looking"

Lost cause, I fear, Hamster, lost cause!

we have had a lot of stuff on here about men/ trans/ transgender / transsexual people ( delete according to taste) being in the ladies loos.

It's never been JUST about the toilets and if you don't "get" that then you're utterly missing the point, and frankly being self-centred.

Try thinking about words like "safeguarding", "erasure", "consent", "protection", as a wider picture instead of whether you can nip in "the ladies" for a pee.