Nic Williams on Woman's Hour (Tuesday) talking about sport and gender identity

The future, where men beat up women and make the women work harder. Where there are no sex segregated spaces.

m.youtube.com/watch?v=S7JtsyNCnpk

So women are coasting?

Gosh yes. The transformation of performance by young women in the recent Winter Olympics (snowboarding, the ski events) is blatant evidence of the coasting - what with them using manoeuvres that women weren't even doing 3 years ago.

And don't get me started on the performance of those layabout women who recently set canoeing records (i.e., for anyone, not just the women) in the Devizes-Westminster event.

Nonetheless, as Dr Fond of Beetles says:
Male puberty and testosterone. Testosterone, the androgen driving male physical development, is a wonderful hormone. It is responsible for advantageous skeletal features that develop during male puberty, such as increased height, increased bone size and density, longer limbs, wider hand spans and a narrower pelvis, all of which make a 100m sprint or a slam dunk far easier. It also directs hugely increased muscle building capacity, allowing higher absolute masses to be achieved in shorter training times, mass which, by the way, contains a higher proportion of fast twitch fibres (responsible for explosive power) than observed in female muscles. To support this superior physicality, males have greater lung capacity, a higher VO2 max (the amount of oxygen consumed during high intensity exercise), a bigger heart with faster stroke rate and higher levels of haemoglobin, and thus can oxygenate their muscles more efficiently.
...
Males are better (at sports, at least). Males are faster. Males are stronger. The performance gap between male and female athletes is utterly astounding; it’s not a “gap”, it’s the Grand Canyon. Without sex-segregated sporting categories, the most wonderful 10.49s that female athletics has ever seen would be a footnote in history. We owe it to the female sports stars of today and to the girls who aspire to be tomorrow’s sporting heroes to fight for their right to take home gold.

fondofbeetles.wordpress.com/2018/10/01/harder-better-faster-stronger-why-we-must-protect-female-sports/

I think the insistence that sport should be mixed sex, will have listeners looking at their male family members and friends and thinking “mixed sex sports! Away to fuck!” Peak peak peak! Thank you Beth. 😁

Yes, andy. You only have to go on Strava and check out your local king and queen of the mountain. It's the same all over the world.

Are you talking to people within the sport? There's a big bait and switch going on for a few years now where TRAs will say there's no problem in sport because national federations set the rules and we're all playing within the rules... The national federations say "we're bringing X sport into line with International Olympic Committee guidelines, everything's fine" and BOOM, the IOC guidelines were written by a... male person who identifies as something different from their birth sex. Nothing to see here.

Giles and LIttlebrowndog - agree there's def been signs of panic in Jane G's voice when the gender critical argument is wiping the floor. In all of them but especially today with Dr Nic.

I think she's gender crit and anxious to be balanced (and I think she's doing a good job) but it does seem like there's an element of bbc policing in all this - like there were very strict t&cs about women's hour covering this area

That's good whatsthecomingoverthehill

Here's the others Nic probably had on her list:

whatscomingoverthehill I like it, but you may have been a bit generous with the overlap even!

I'm quite disappointed no-one pointed out the inherent advantages women have in the 'ducking under the bar' event.

Oh I liked the bit were Beth implied there could be a secret transmale Olympic champion.

I'm DEAD

Is that your best argument? Seriously ?

Nice that men are to be held as the gold standard for women's sports.
Tell us something new about how women's achievements are viewed Beth!
And Beth's earnest nonsense sounded like another manifestation of the 'lady brain' argument, only this time it's holding us back.
On the other hand, thought I'd test out her theory so I went to the shops and bought a grand piano and a range cooker with the intention of carrying them the 3 miles home.
I gave myself a stern talking to about being lazy and weak, popped a couple of Wellwoman energy tabs and asked myself 'what would a man do here?'...
Unfortunately I was unable to lift them so promptly got a refund and caught the bus back.
I'll never make it in the modern world, the one that Beth said is coming, and am a total failure.

I've just heard this debate and thought that for once WH has finally (pardon the pun) grown a pair and Jane Garvey articulated things that she certainly wouldn't have done just a short while ago, even going as far as to point out that the term CIS-woman actually applies to the vast majority of the population who simply call themselves "women".. Perhaps the Emperor's new clothes are being seen for what they are and we can start the trans-rights debate properly now ..? Or am I just being silly?

cap their capability psychologically

Oh Beth, why don’t women just try harder? You silly females. You’re just as strong and fast as men.

All those women that can’t get away from the men that are mauling, raping, beating and murdering them, should just ‘believed’ themselves to be strong enough to fight them off. Wanker.

SecondRow

Yes men absolutely could flatten a woman, I think with martial arts it's the respect thing why they don't. In competition amongst older children where they've had to compete mixed I've always seen the refs decide that some moves are not allowed beforehand because it's mixed or if say a higher belt ends up fighting a lower belt as there's not enough in the catagory otherwise

It's not like they say yeah go for it without acknowledging it needs adapting for safety in competition

Hence I thought a 17 year old girl could fight males of her weight in a fair fight in that competition

Thank you Dr Nic Williams.

My summary of the trans inclusion in sports argument.

the TRA standpoint on trans women in sport shows exactly who they are and what they’re about. When someone shows you who they are, believe them...

Lauren Hubbard, ten years older than the oldest of the other female weigh lifters, has spent 90%of her life as a male. Nothing to see here folks.

Another women's hour TRA, Layla had trouble controlling herself so Layla cut her body to control her brain - it's left her with vitamin deficiencies - Layla looks good and can see into souls - so all is good.

Layla thinks children should be cut up and their health damaged so they look good, Layla doesn't care how their health is or if they are still mentally ill, as long as they look good - all is ok.

www.dailymail.co.uk/health/article-6456363/How-stomach-stapling-operation-gave-Layla-confidence-MP.html

megletthesecond I always big up touch rugby as a sport where mixed sex teams work really well, even more so that racket sports I think.

Questioning my gender !!
Fucking questioning my sanity now at what Jones just spouted and seemed to believe
Surely not no one could believe that

That stupid, misogynist has decided that a future where there is no such thing as women in sport is an ideal to be sought.

Thank God Garvey said it was 'horrifying'.

And, like PPs - I did judo as a teen and in uni, trained with boys and men in both clubs, the culture was all about respect so they didn't flatten me but even then I'm pretty sure they could have. Which is why in competition it was only girls against girls. Obviously.

AND then I played rugby for a few years in my late twenties/early thirties. We had tiny teenage girls on our team as well as older women who were already mothers. Any one of us could seriously have been killed if we had actually played against the guys team who were training right next to us on the pitch. Now that I think about it, we had to scatter when a rolling maul crashed over the sidelines from their side onto ours. They weren't going to say, oh hold on lads, there's some women standing there Much less if we were the opposition. FFS.