NYTimes: A Vagina Won't Make Me Happy - But It's My Right to Get One Anyway

I need a knee replacement. If I were 20 years older I would be having one.

Because of my age the NHS won't do it yet.

Why can't I just insist then? I want it done. I understand the risks. It will make things better not worse and it's going to have to be done at some point. Why can't I just have it? Why should the dr be able to over ride me?

If it's ok to a C section on demand then it's ok to have any surgery on demand?

Yes angry

And youve arrived just in time for it

As long as women have the full and correct information to make an informed choice, they should be able to give birth any way they want. I strongly believe c section on request should be a right.

Yes. I so wholeheartedly agree, Bowlofbabelfish.

And for the record: no it is not comparable to plastic surgery or SRS, the baby will have to come out one way or another. You cannot just not act, there will be 'blood', so to speak.

Is it pretendy logic time again, with a sideline in unconvincing analogies?

Bowlofbabelfish

It all depends on your definition of mental harm though doesn't it?

And who makes the value judgement as to who can have surgery on demand?

Just rechecked the thread

No i havent missed anything

Massive plastic tits don’t

Because a c section on demand has a rationale for harm reduction, either mental or physical.

I dont think a c section is the same as plastic surgery

I may have missed something though

Then if you think a C section should be given on demand, why not other surgery?

How do you draw lines between different treatments? Either we accept paternalistic " dr knows best" treatment (as described by the gate keeping dr above) or you allow patients autonomy over their own bodies.

You can't really pick and choose what treatments will be available to others based on your own needs can you?

Ever since I have wondered, whether it is right to not allow women the choice in this (as long as it does not endanger rhe lives of baby and mother, obviously), considering they have to live with the consequences for the rest of their lives

As long as women have the full and correct information to make an informed choice, they should be able to give birth any way they want. I strongly believe c section on request should be a right.

'I hate how huge fake plastic boobs are described as breasts.'

Hell yes.

I hate how huge fake plastic boobs are described as breasts.

In the particular context I described, it is above all highly irresponsible, as it suggests that an underage girl who gets a mastectomy (which Ehrensaft&Co advocate for), can always reverse the decision. Which is patently untrue, as you do not get back the function, a function whose loss these young girls may very well regret later.

I hate how huge fake plastic boobs are described as breasts.

Breasts are made of tissue, not silicone and their purpose is to feed babies.

In the case of this individual, they have already admitted it will exacerbate their existing mental illness and will not bring about any relief from dysphoria, therefore, it would be unethical for a doctor to carry out surgery.

Quite. First, do no harm. And this is a patient who admits from the outset that the surgery is causing them harm. Ethics aside, what surgeon wants to risk the inevitable lawsuit?

It's happening here too. Women pay privately to have a C Section don't they when they wouldn't have one on the NGS unless there was a clinical need.

The choice of C-section or no C-section is a very sensitive topic for me. When pregnant, and researching birth complication statistics, I realized that I could better live with the potential complications of a C-section to those of a natural birth.

I had a fallout with a doctor over saying as much on some information night (to be clear, I could not choose and did not demand I can choose. The doc just asked, whether we thought the birth experience can be planned. To which I responded, well a scheduled C-section will presumably be quite well plannable. At which point the doc called a C-section this super risky thing - and from there it escalated. I sure knew my stats and in the end the doc told me I should not scare the other women. Not sure why they should know everything about possible complications of C-sections but not about those of 4th degree tears. But Ok. It turned pretty nasty)

In the end my child (first child) was breech, so it was a 'compulsory' scheduled C-section, which was good as the baby had the cord twice tightly wrapped around his neck. There really would not have been a choice and in pre-C-section times we would both not have made it.

Ever since I have wondered, whether it is right to not allow women the choice in this (as long as it does not endanger rhe lives of baby and mother, obviously), considering they have to live with the consequences for the rest of their lives.

It feels like getting on an airplane to fly home, only to realize mid-flight that this is it: You’re going to spend the rest of your life on an airplane

So, an entirely irrational belief that has no basis in reality.

If someone said they felt like they were trapped on an airplane would you prescribe a parachute?

Maybe the author of this article won't have the surgery. I am talking generally.

But this thread isn't about surgery generally, it's about a specific case.

No ethical doctor will perform a procedure that will make the condition of the patient worse. The writer of the article under discussion has admitted that surgery will damage their mental health and lead to more suffering, yet they are still insisting they must have that surgery.

This is what I find scary about this article. And it very much aligns with this consumerist mindset that is advocated by some professionals on the trans-train, like Ehrensaft 'a touch of testosterone, for the nonbinary identity,.... just cut 'em off, you can always get new breasts later, ...'

Maybe in this case but not in all cases.

Maybe the author of this article won't have the surgery. I am talking generally.

But this surgery does not definitely make someone's condition worse. People have it done and are happy with the results. I have no idea in this case and presume that the person concerned will be working through things with their doctor.

In the case of this individual, they have already admitted it will exacerbate their existing mental illness and will not bring about any relief from dysphoria, therefore, it would be unethical for a doctor to carry out surgery.

The thinking of a society where medical care is paid for. If you have the money, it's your right to get anything you want,

It's happening here too. Women pay privately to have a C Section don't they when they wouldn't have one on the NGS unless there was a clinical need.

But I also believe that surgery’s only prerequisite should be a simple demonstration of want.

The thinking of a society where medical care is paid for. If you have the money, it's your right to get anything you want, even surgery when your real problem is psychological. If you don't have the money, well....

This is about medical ethics, something you should understand as a nurse. No ethical doctor will perform a procedure that will make the condition of the patient worse

But this surgery does not definitely make someone's condition worse. People have it done and are happy with the results. I have no idea in this case and presume that the person concerned will be working through things with their doctor.

I am unsure why people are refusing to see the similarities with cosmetic surgery. If you see gender reassignment surgery as unethical then do you not see cosmetic surgery as unethical? To undertake a procedure on a healthy patient and expose them to all of the risks that surgery poses just to alter their physical appearance? Is that not unethical?

To participate in the growing pressure within society to make people feel bad about "normal" bodies? Isn't that unethical?

The concern about medical ethics only appears to relate to gender reassignment surgery and I can't work out why?