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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

10,000 Dresses

83 replies

NotZenEnough · 22/11/2018 20:49

This book is about a little boy called Bailey. He dreams of dresses, so is referred to as 'she' throughout the book. His parents are obviously complete gits because they think he's a boy. All the characters in the book are stereotypically male or female. Basically it's a bag of shit, and us being read in my son's primary school.
He had it read to him in Y2 and Y4. I know it has also been read in a Y2 assembly.

The SRE teacher is very bright and sensible, and I think generally understands the GC argument. Deputy head bit more 'woke' & doesn't really understand.
I've been in to the school to ask them to stop teaching it, and have tried to raise awareness on the school Facebook page.
Just thought I'd share because I had no idea that this was being taught to children in our primary school.

10,000 Dresses
10,000 Dresses
10,000 Dresses
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fridaysdust · 23/11/2018 19:26

NotZenEnough - your school sound very like my DCs school (and is in the same area). I know of 2 former pupils who are 13/14 now and transgender, both with autistic traits. I know at least one of my DC has read 10,000 Dresses so wouldn't be surprised if those children have. Could be worth highlighting to the school the disproportionately large number of autistic children identifying as transgender and asking them if they have noticed this trend amongst former pupils.

RepealTheGRA · 23/11/2018 18:24

Probably also worth asking what their safeguarding procedures are with these people coming into schools!

NotZenEnough · 23/11/2018 18:20

I found out which teacher heads up SRE And asked specifically which resources they use for their LGBT education, plus whether they have any resources which specifically deal with the transgender issue. Plus who advises them on SRE. External groups often advise schools. Our school has 'diversity role models' come in and talk, but they do not directly discuss trans, although they do include the word in LGBT. The borough council has a section on diversity in their web site and they are tied up with Diversity Role Models.

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littlecabbage · 23/11/2018 18:10

Thanks. I need to do this. Hope I'm not in for a nasty shock.

RepealTheGRA · 23/11/2018 18:01

littlecabbage write and ask, if they don’t want to tell you that is extremely suspicious!

littlecabbage · 23/11/2018 17:59

How do you find out what is on your children's school's reading list? Write to the head? Ask the class teacher? Are they obliged to tell you?

NotZenEnough · 23/11/2018 16:58

Bloody help re ferret and vole! That would send me stratospheric.

The kids like this rubbish book! I gather it is generally well received. Haven't had feedback saying it's been a problem on a personal level.

Kids like some really crap things though.

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stillathing · 23/11/2018 15:53

It would be a far better story if it called out the rigid attitudes of Bailey's horrible relatives and let him be a happy boy who likes dresses.

Exactly. Also doesn't this book accidentally admit that one thing that can lead to a kid thinking they are trans is having regressive, homophobic parents? Can the author not see that? And if the story were true how could anyone conclude that the problem wasn't the attitude of the parents, rather than the body of the child?

Well done for challenging this OP.

LordProfFekkoThePenguinPhD · 23/11/2018 15:42

Don’t know - this is just news to me!

RepealTheGRA · 23/11/2018 15:42

Do you know how they were received by the kids?

LordProfFekkoThePenguinPhD · 23/11/2018 15:37

They are secondary kids - so thank god not little kids. I ask you. I’m trying to find out which teacher organised this. Hrrr, hedgehog and otter indeed.

RepealTheGRA · 23/11/2018 15:34

LordProfFekkoThePenguinPhD

I hope you’re complaining about that to school, MP and DfE? There really needs to be some accountability over who is being let near our children and exactly what their motives are.

I am childishly snorting at ‘ferret and vole’Grin

LordProfFekkoThePenguinPhD · 23/11/2018 15:31

Just seen school notice that ferret and vole (or whatever they are called) spoke at DS school. I really wished I’d known beforehand.

LordProfFekkoThePenguinPhD · 23/11/2018 15:16

Boy ‘I want a sparkly dress’
Mum and dad ‘fine, son - here you go’
Boy ‘yippee’
Mum and dad ‘just don’t wear it when great Aunty Maude comes around’
Boy ‘ok!’
Mum and dad ‘thanks, son’

Fast forward a few years
Boy ‘mum, dad, I’m think I’m gay!’
Mum and dad ‘well we kind of guessed, son’

And they all lived - ever after.

FIN

MarshaBradyo · 23/11/2018 14:13

It’s always dresses isn’t it. What about a doll. Where do these people draw the lines

So bloody flimsy. Boys enjoy the whole range as do girls.

The book is insulting to good thinking in so many ways, how the hell did it get published? Or written? By people who spot a trend and dangerously lack rigour.

RepealTheGRA · 23/11/2018 13:28

Telling a boy he can’t wear a dress because he’s a boy is abusive behaviour. Calling a boy ‘she’ because he’s wearing a dress is also abusive behaviour.

Both behaviours reinforce gender stereotyping which schools are supposed to challenge not try and embed toxic masculinity into their students!

Anybody who encounters this book in their child’s school can and should challenge it on the basis of it being a thoroughly shit and regressive book without even needing to get onto the trans issue!

OP - what’s your MP like? Worth a letter to them? If not go to DfE?

deepwatersolo · 23/11/2018 13:02

My son loves sparkly dresses. Especially Elsa's. Because he's a young kid and likes sparkly stuff and to dress up. I would hit the roof if the school told him he's no longer a boy and should be called 'she'. Fuck off.

Exactly. This is an awful message to send to young kids. Peers may even feel justified droning on about why he is not really a boy if he likes sparkly stuff. It is nuts.

NotZenEnough · 23/11/2018 12:57

Have one gov on side I think, or at least understanding. Chair of govs knows a family with a trans kid and I think may be harder to get on side.
Am going to write to each individually.

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Blanketbox · 23/11/2018 12:51

Have you discussed with the governors?

KatharinaRosalie · 23/11/2018 12:50

My son loves sparkly dresses. Especially Elsa's. Because he's a young kid and likes sparkly stuff and to dress up. I would hit the roof if the school told him he's no longer a boy and should be called 'she'. Fuck off.

MarshaBradyo · 23/11/2018 12:20

That is unbelievably awful

NotZenEnough · 23/11/2018 12:19

Adult sufferers of gender dysphoria do sometimes decide that surgical or medical interventions are their preferred treatment, and some remain happy with this in the long run, but it is entirely inappropriate for children to be expected to make life changing decisions like this. Gender dysphoria is a frightening and destructive condition and ’10,000 Dresses’ is part of a movement which actually induces gender dysphoria in children. We would not be reading a book which promoted the idea of anorexia to young children.
‘10,000 Dresses’ also raises issues of safeguarding and makes a direct recommendation to a child that if their parents do not affirm their belief that they are born in the wrong body, then they should seek support outside their family. Many children seek support from web platforms and social media such as tumblr, and it is easy to find evidence of adults on these platforms encouraging children to transition and telling them that if their parents do not accept their new gender identity, their parents do not care about them. These unidentified adults can be seen offering to become a confused child’s ‘new daddy’ or ‘new mummy’. The risks are obvious. I know this is a worst case scenario, but it is happening.
Of course, there are times where it is entirely appropriate and desirable for a child to seek support from a trusted teacher, and of course this should not be discouraged, but the message in this book is more sinister, and leaves children vulnerable. The Transgender Rights Lobby (which this book is a part of) routinely advises schools that best practise is for a teacher or other adult to be able to have confidential conversations with a gender questioning child with no obligation to inform parents or anyone else. This is a clear breach of safeguarding guidelines.
’10,000 dresses’ also presents archaic and regressive gender stereotypes. It suggests that if a boy likes dresses or doesn’t like football then he must be a girl. The idea that a gender non-conforming boy is turned in to a gender conforming girl is homophobic.
I am well aware that this is only one of many books which are read to the children at •••school, and I know that plenty of other books have very positive ways of addressing outdated gender stereotypes, and will go some way to counteracting the negative effects of this book. However, I absolutely maintain that there is no place in a school for literature which reinforces outdated and corrosive gender stereotypes, undermines safeguarding and suggests that a child may be born in the wrong body.
I would like to reiterate a point that I made in our meeting that I celebrate and encourage diversity in children, and their right to self-expression. I would fight hard for any child that does identify as transgender to be treated with respect and tolerance, and that bullying of any type for any reason is unacceptable. I do however think that the •••school ethos is strong enough for that message of tolerance and kindness to be strong enough in the children without them actually having to be read a book of this nature on this specific topic.
I have spoken to •••teacher and asked that she ensure that this book is not read to •••son again. I would like to extend that request and ask that no other transgender propaganda is read to him. •••son has agreed to be removed from any lesson or assembly where the book is being read and is happy to explain to anyone who asks that it is because of his annoying mother.
I hope you understand,

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NotZenEnough · 23/11/2018 12:19

Posting this is two parts as I think it's too big for one post.

This is what I sent to school after the meeting. Long and boring I'm afraid but if anyone is dealing with the same thing pls feel free to copy and paste.
I wish I had written that the regressive stereotypes in the book seem even more ridiculous if you flip the sex of the main character. If it was a biological girl that liked wearing trousers would she be a boy?!

Dear •••
Having had a few days to think about our meeting, I feel compelled to communicate further about the book ’10,000 Dresses’.
The fundamental message of the book is that a child can be born in the wrong body. This is an appalling message to give to a child, it is untrue and dangerous. As adults we have a responsibility to protect children from destructive ideas and untruths like this. Children are born in their body and that is the only body they will ever have. There is no scientific basis for the idea that a person can be born in the wrong body, or that there are male and female brains. Furthermore, if a child genuinely believes that they are born in the wrong body, subjecting that healthy body to dangerous, untested and damaging medication and surgical interventions will not result in that body becoming the right body. A child suffering from gender dysphoria needs support and help. Not unchecked affirmation as demanded by the well funded Transgender Rights Lobby; groups like ‘Mermaids’, ‘Gires’, ‘Allsorts’ and ‘Gendered Intelligence’.

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NotZenEnough · 23/11/2018 12:12

Dear god. My dad had a handbag in the 70s. He got it in France where men often have - well, little handbags. He said it was very useful when you didn’t have pockets and we were absolutely mortified and took the mickey (a lot).
Funny that, I was thinking about a school French teacher in the '80's who was gifted a handbag by a French friend. He though it was hilarious. Had the class in fits of laughter as he did impressions of an effeminate man with a handbag.
Bless your gnc dad!

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LordProfFekkoThePenguinPhD · 23/11/2018 10:43

Dear god. My dad had a handbag in the 70s. He got it in France where men often have - well, little handbags. He said it was very useful when you didn’t have pockets and we were absolutely mortified and took the mickey (a lot).

How could we have been so blind? Dad was obviously a woman. As are most French men. Good luck with explaining that to the French embassy.

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