Stella O'Malley, Trans Kids: It's Time To Talk

Very true, R0wan. Wisdom and empathy should really be telling each of us when our experiences and voices are necessary. Its quite revealing when someone insists their voice is required everywhere just because they have the ability to speak.

Tinsel.

Acorninspring thank you. I'm quite a long way through in my own recovery. It seemed to me that there is an analogy though and I only share this to illustrate it.
I wouldn't have been able to voice such feelings, experiences in the past when it was all very raw.

Exactly, R0 - and behooves us all to know when our presence is not neutral: it is an intrusion.

for you.

Additionally there are spaces where I can go to share my personal experience about infertility, also ones specific to the cause (gyny cancer) and finally spaces where women with gyny cancer dealing with their infertility (eg younger women) can speak safely, privately and with dignity. The last space is very small but really important for women affected. Talking with women there was such an important part of my recovery. I understand (in a different context) the incredibly damaging effects of isolation on top of really difficult experiences & also the massive benefits of finding shared experieces and mutual support with women who have a shared profound understanding.

I mean

flowers R0

By way of an analogy there are vast numbers of threads on Mumsnet (unsuprisingly as its a parenting website) where mothers discuss things which I may have an opinion about (sometimes strong feelings), an alternative perspective etc. However I recognise that its not appropriate for me as someone carrying griefs about my own infertility to voice them there. It is of course my right, within the 'rules' of the platform. The reasons why its innapropriate are as much about me recognising & understanding why I may feel strongly at that point as understanding & respecting the the needs of the mothers posting.

I'm not asking where (for obvious reasons) but wondering if there is any safe, private, dignified space where women can go to discuss the things they might need to when their male partner begins 'exploring' his gender identity? If there is supportive space anywhere that women who remain (at that point) with their partners so they have the possibility of beginning to speak freely solely with other women?

I have been wondering this myself. This very thread has made me see that there is a need for such a space, safe from unwanted male intrusions.

I get what you're saying Deep, but I wouldn't be here if my ex had got here first. I'm lucky he didn't work that out.

tinsel I've been thinking more about the points raised on last few pages of this thread.

I'm not asking where (for obvious reasons) but wondering if there is any safe, private, dignified space where women can go to discuss the things they might need to when their male partner begins 'exploring' his gender identity?
If there is supportive space anywhere that women who remain (at that point) with their partners so they have the possibility of beginning to speak freely solely with other women?

On rewatching it I will say that my favorite moment of the documentary was when the fully masked protester who violently tried to force her way in got exasperated at the impertinence - or rather literal violence, I guess - of being addressed with the wrong pronouns.

Maybe Paglia has a point when she says this kind of stuff is what happens, when civilizations go to die. Surely, this level of stupidity must make survival hard, even under the best of circumstances.

Ereshkigal Thanks so much. It's heartbreaking and I'm sharing it

Not just unhappy, angry. It can't be good for her holding in that much anger, and having people "Well done" her for doing so it just making her angrier.

I was similarly struck by the woman interviewed on the BBC as NotTerfNorCis commented on the TransWidows thread wrote:

Yes me too. I watched it on the back of that, thinking, it couldn't be so obvious that she was unhappy. But it was.

SignMeUp

twitter.com/birdcatcher9/status/1066305184542801921?s=20

See, I look at the table that has a pile of random stuff on it and just think "meh, whatever". No domestic goddess aspirations at all. If DH feels like tidying he's welcome to, but he doesn't care either, so mess it is.

What I have is an inner Wednesday Addams.

I think I have a half Beryl.

I can tell men to fuck right off no problem but I can’t quite ditch the dream of the perfectly clean and tidy home.

Actually, I think my Beryl is related specifically to being a mother, rather than generally being female.

Perhaps she’ll piss off when the littlest leaves home?

I better start practicing saying no to requests to look after any future grand babies now.

I've never had a Beryl, which is why attempts to appeal to my "listen patiently to my tales of male woe, which are far more important than whatever a woman may be dealing with, and if you don't you're a big meanie" socialization don't work.

Beryl has a lot to answer for.

She needs to ‘sling ‘er ‘ook’ as my Nan would say (Nan did not have a Beryl. I suspect she died in WW2. No need for a Beryl when you are in the WRAF and all the men are overseas).

The fact that Debbie hadn't thought of the effects on their poor wife and kids says it all. Male entitlement and selfishness.

Whenever I hear anyone talk about women staying with their husbands post-transition as making the best of it I always wonder "the best for whom"? Certainly not for the wives, based on everything I've ever heard from their perspective.

I fell that like many other recent threads this thread ties back to the Beryl one.

OMFG that thread

BettyDuMonde

Oldcrone;
Face to face met? Yes, one, in Brighton quite some while ago. This person was a member of the Clare Project. I can mention it as it was in the early years of this century. If your point is that it must be very rare, I agree. Very.

Anecdotally, I know of a couple of f to m people who transitioned from a civil partnership, and the partnership did not survive. Well, it probably wouldn't, would it?

I know ( face to face) of several rather elderly ( 70 plus) m to fs who have stayed married to/ living with their wives, apparently on a " least worst " basis of making the best of it after 50 years together. In one case the TS woman is a full time carer for the spouse.

No-one is claiming that it is a good situation. In most cases it is a disaster.

QED

With bells on.

The OP types fairly well for a person using only one hand.

Kleenex will never go out of business!

Kay do you know of any transmen who have transitioned whilst married to men?