Please or to access all these features

Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Please help - friends work place insisting male who is transitioning to female uses female toilet and female communal changing area - how to word a non discriminatory email to CEO

40 replies

Sommelierrrr · 18/11/2018 22:07

Hi there please could anyone help? My friend is not anti the transition of this man or discriminatory in any way. However, she is concerned about their use of these private women's areas at work. Can anyone suggest how she words an email expressing her discomfort?

OP posts:
New posts on this thread. Refresh page
JenFromTheGlen · 19/11/2018 21:57

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Xenia · 19/11/2018 21:14

As said above you only change ender in law once you have gone through the full process. There are some plans to change the law but it has not changed yet.

Sexnotgender · 19/11/2018 21:04

See attached

Please help - friends work place insisting male who is transitioning to female uses female toilet and female communal changing area - how to word a non discriminatory email to CEO
Please help - friends work place insisting male who is transitioning to female uses female toilet and female communal changing area - how to word a non discriminatory email to CEO
JenFromTheGlen · 19/11/2018 20:53

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

frankexchangeofviews · 19/11/2018 17:56

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

BettyDuMonde · 19/11/2018 16:49

To be fair, I imagine a proportion of the ‘non op’ transwomen can’t have the surgery due to other health issues?

A trans friend of mine wasn’t accepted as a candidate for full surgical transition as they had numerous preexisting non-related health conditions dating back to childhood.

Being turned down for surgery made my friend very depressed, so I just wanted to point out that there must be at least a few who would love to ditch their dick but can’t.
Not fair for those people to be lumped in with a certain NUS Officer who allegedly wanked at bus stops and in the workplace!

This is why I support medical gatekeeping and legal gatekeeping, for both the protection of women and the medical safety of transpeople.

Littlepic · 19/11/2018 16:32

That's very interesting that 85% keep their penis. I wonder if that is due to lack or funds/funding for the operation or lack of desire to have the operation. I suspect a combination of the two!

BettyDuMonde · 19/11/2018 16:04

I would probably point out the protrans guidelines re: giving an alternative provision for the women who object to sharing with a transgender MtF person. i’d ask where that provision will be located and what assessments have been done to ensure that it will be adequate the numbers of women who require access to it - ie, have they surveyed how many women are employed from conservative religions, how many have been victims of Male violence, and how many require single sex provisions for reasons of privacy and dignity?

Mamaryllis · 19/11/2018 15:25

There is no ‘completion of transition’. Most (85%) of transwomen keep a fully functioning penis.

Mamaryllis · 19/11/2018 15:23

TRAs will tell you that the intent to transition is enough because of the wording in the GRA. The EA tells you that single sex provision can be legal in specific situations.
There is no legal self-ID currently but most organizations are ‘getting ahead of the law’ and are too scared/ woke to implement the EA exemptions and say no. So they accept any old bloke as a woman if he says he is.
Like girl guides etc.
I work in uni housing. Anyone who says they are a woman gets accommodated in female housing.

ShotsFired · 19/11/2018 15:12

If I was feeling antagonistic I'd organise the women to use the men's facilities en masse instead. Make the men deal with their own problems.

But I know it is risky to be so aggressive about it, so in reality, I think I would formally request a same-sex/sex-segregated space for females under the relevant law (being very deliberate and specific on the terminology used), just as titch suggests.

But I do think a united front is more useful than a lone voice, for many reasons, so if you can rally, do that.

Littlepic · 19/11/2018 15:00

Ok so where do you stand if someone is transitioning and identifying as female but not yet completed the transition, and women are expected to share toilets and communal changing facilities as in this case?

Sexnotgender · 19/11/2018 14:56

And a touch passive-aggressive

Nothing wrong with thatWink

UpstartCrow · 19/11/2018 14:53

Littlepic Technically, self ID has not been introduced in the UK; but the Equality Act states that you gain the characteristic of gender reassignment if you are proposing to change your gender.
You do not then have to make any changes.

titchy · 19/11/2018 14:50

Compassionate but clear.

And a touch passive-aggressive Wink

Littlepic · 19/11/2018 14:45

Excuse my ignorance on this but can I ask. Can people self ID in the U.K. at the moment and if not what changes does a person have to make to change their gender?

Sexnotgender · 19/11/2018 14:12

I like titchys email. Compassionate but clear.

Blanketbox · 19/11/2018 12:49

Also note that toilets are one thing and communal changing is another. Communal changing rooms offer no privacy and it is completely unacceptable to expect women to change with a man in this situation.

titchy · 19/11/2018 12:44

I'd be inclined to email the CEO something along the lines of:

'Thank you for informing us about X using the female toilets in the future. As I am sure you are aware, as it is illegal for a workplace to have mixed toilets unless they are completely enclosed cubicles with a washbasin inside we assume there will be a period of building work shortly. Could you let us know when this building work will be taking place and what arrangements will be in place during said building work.

We of course wish X every happiness in their journey.'

wheezy2 · 19/11/2018 12:42

Such a great idea to use a throw away email account for stuff like this Smile

uglyandlovingit · 19/11/2018 12:33

I would send an anonymous email from a throwaway account to management telling them that women are concerned, etc. send them the Women's Place resources

Sexnotgender · 19/11/2018 12:29

If the workplace wish to convert their ladies toilets to mixed sex then they need to ensure they are complying with the relevant regulations.
Namely that the toilets need to be fully enclosed rooms, NOT cubicles and the hand washing facilities need to be inside aforementioned fully enclosed room.

Chesneyhawkes1 · 19/11/2018 12:21

We had this where I work. A male transitioning to a female. Where I work there are approx 200 men compared to roughly 10 women. We all received a letter from HR explaining the situation and informing us that the person would be using the women's facilities. We were offered the right to object to that. As far as I know no one did.

Sommelierrrr · 19/11/2018 12:10

Thanks so much for all helpful feedback it's very much appreciated. I've passed this on to my friend and wonder if there is anything else posters feel she should be cautious of or aware of?

OP posts:
sashh · 19/11/2018 11:06

Suggesting that trans peopel use facilities for disabled people is shit for disabled poeple

As a disabled person I can say my life is much more impacted by the toilets being the default baby changing.

In the workplace I'm most impacted by people using the accessible toilet to get changed before they go out after work.

As a disabled woman who can use some ladies facilities I never have to share space with anyone while washing my hands in the accessible toilet, I do in the ladies.

Leicester uni library has a cafe with real gender neutral toilets, a heavy floor to ceiling door with a good lock. Once inside you have a toilet, hand basin, st bin, hand dryer and paper towels. There are about 5 or 6 of them.

Swipe left for the next trending thread