Can university compel professor to use student's requested title? Ohio lawsuit

Popchyk also asked, Why shouldn't the transgender student leave their own belief system at the classroom door?

Again, I'm speaking solely of the US, where I am & where this situation occurred & the lawsuit has been filed:

Anyone in the US is to free to go anywhere they want with their own belief system in tow, no matter how daft that belief system may be. But no one is allowed to demand that other people accept, honor, respect, kowtow to or adhere to their belief system in part or whole. And no one can demand that others shut up & pretend to respect their belief system to make the believers happy, give them validation, protect them from offense - or to foster social harmony or preserve community relations more generally. In the US, we can even ridicule, disrespect & speak the unpleasant truth about religious figures, which the ECHR has recently ruled is not allowed in the EU, at least not when it comes to Mohammed.

And equally you do not have the right in law to compel someone to use your chosen title.
No you can’t make someone use your chosen title. However if they’re purposely calling you a different title for discriminatory reasons then you potentially have a case against them. Gender is a protected characteristic.

Thanks for the info, Veg.

Interesting.

Popchyk asked, But why should one belief system (Christianity) be less important than another belief system (the idea that you can change sex)?

Because, everyone, this situation occurred in the US, it's a US federal lawsuit, & the US Constitution enshrines freedom to practice religion without interference as a fundamental right. And it's not Christian beliefs specifically that are protected by the US Constitution, it's the right of individuals to practice any religion.

True, the belief system known as trans ideology or transgenderism has much in common with a religious belief system. But transgenderism is not (yet) officially recognized as a religion in the US, so a person's right to believe in & practice it is not protected by the First Amendment the way religion is.

That's not to say transgender people don't have rights in the US. Transgender people have all the same civil rights as everyone else in the US. And that's saying a lot, because people in the US have the most extensive rights ever granted by any government anywhere - except, of course, the right to free medical care, housing, lifetime welfare & so on. But hey, that's OK, because we have the right to bear arms, so we can all shoot ourselves when we get sick, become impoverished or lose our homes. Just kidding.

However, in the US transgender people don't have special or additional rights that the rest of us don't have, which is what TRAs - & the student in this case, Alena Bruening - are seeking. (And contrary to what everyone keeps claiming, the Trump admin isn't attempting to roll back or deny civil rights for trans people, nor are they planning to erase or "define trans people out of existence.")

Social titles aren’t part of your name. They aren’t used for identity purposes. Check your passport, there’s no Miss or Mr in there. Your social title is merely a convention and as such you are free to use any social title you choose. I can be a Mr if I like. Or a Mrs even if I’m not married. Nobody has the right to tell me what I may call myself - I have the legal right to call myself whatever I like.

Also, if no one has the right to tell me what to call myself, does that then mean I have the right to dictate how others address me?

"Nobody, regardless of their religion, has the right to dictate what name you choose to call yourself".

And equally you do not have the right in law to compel someone to use your chosen title.

You can't make other people call you by your preferred title. I am Dr and married and like being called Ms rather than Mrs, but I can't stop people calling me Mrs or even Miss (as sometimes happens) if they want.
It feels rude but I don't have any legal redress against them.

I trust that this professor is getting a garage or rape and death threats? I imagine he will be fired too?

No? Why ever not?!?

Lewismam

That's an interesting position - do you believe it is never right to refuse to comply with laws you find morally or ethically objectionable? Is legality what determines goodness/correctness?

Which laws are you talking about Lewis? Are you in the UK?

Which law compels people to refer to another person as Mr, Miss, Mrs etc?

And which law allows people to present as the opposite sex? What does "present as the opposite sex" even mean? Does it mean that if a man who identifies as a woman is caught in a string vest and a pair of budgie smugglers, then he will be jailed or something? By West Yorkshire Police presumably.

Hmmm lewis I think yr talking shite.

In the UK you have the legal right to use any name you choose. Titles are only a social convention. Anyone can choose to go by any title, with the obvious exception of titles that require a particular job, qualification or position eg Professor, Reverend, Duke, etc.

Anyone can choose to be called Miss. As a married woman I can choose to be called Miss. My DH is a big hairy bloke and can also choose to be called Miss if he so wishes. Nobody, regardless of their religion, has the right to dictate what name you choose to call yourself.

Where does the law say you have the right to be referred to by the title you want?

Yes the law says that people are allowed to practise their religion but that shouldn’t extend to denying someone else their legal rights just because your religion thinks they shouldn’t have those rights.

Regardless, our legal system permits people to present as the opposite sex and assume the appropriate title. People have a legal right to do so regardless of how any particular individual feels about it. Refusing to acknowledge that is basically refusing to acknowledge the laws of the society in which you live. Individuals should not be allowed to deny people their legal rights just because they personally believe those people shouldn’t have those rights.

Article 9 of the Human Rights Act enshrines the right to freedom of religion and belief. And also the right to manifest your beliefs.

To refuse to respect that makes a mockery of society since the right to freedom of religion and belief is enshrined in law.

Transgender people may disagree with the right to freedom of religion but that view is at odds with the rest of society and its laws. The law must take precedence over any particular individual’s beliefs. And the law says that people are allowed to practise their religion.

No, that’s not true. People cannot change sex. Gender dysphoria can be allieviated by presenting as the opposite sex, but no sex change actually happens. forcing people to lie is never a good idea & only ends badly.

This isn't about the legal change. It is highly unlikely the student has been through the administrative change.
It absolutely is a belief system because they don't believe they have CHANGED sex, they believe they ARE the opposite sex and that they were wrongly assigned at birth.

Imo transgender isn’t a belief system. They don’t “believe” they’ve changed sex.

But they do. They haven't actually changed sex. They may, as you say, have changed their sex legally, but that would be a legal fiction with no bearing on material reality. A company can be legally considered a person - that doesn't mean that that company is a person.

The belief that human beings can change sex is just that, a belief. The belief that there are gendered souls or essences which can somehow be placed in the wrongly-sexed body is a metaphysical belief comparable to religion.

Imo transgender isn’t a belief system. They don’t “believe” they’ve changed sex. They have actual paperwork and have gone through whatever concrete procedures our society has decided are required for that change to take place. To refuse to respect that makes a mockery of society which has decided that such a change is permissible, legal and possible.

Christians may disagree with changing gender but that view is at odds with the rest of society and its laws. The law must take precedence over any particular individual’s beliefs. And the law says that people are allowed to change gender.

Having read everything I can about this case, I've found that most press reports of this saga leave out some key facts. And all ignore & fail to address the proverbial elephant in the room entirely.

The elephant, of course, is how the student in this case - whose preferred name is Alena Bruening - looks in terms of sex characteristics & presents in terms of gender expression, & by what name Bruening is listed in the class roster & registration materials the professor was provided with when the term started.

My guess is that in the professor's eyes, Alena Bruening looks like a bloke, & that even if he presents as female or trans, he does so more like Jess Bradley than Blaire White. I also have a hunch the initial registration records for the class did not list Bruening as Alena. But these are just conjectures. I tried to find pictures of Bruening, but there are none to be found anywhere online, not even on Facebook.

I also think it might be a mistake to see this case solely or primarily through the lens of employment law because the lawsuit might frame it as more than a conflict between employee vs. employer. My hunch is that the suit alleges that Shawnee State University - an Ohio state-operated institution funded by local, state & federal tax revenues - is not simply the professor's employer here, it's an arm of the government.

As such, it could be argued, the university unconstitutionally interfered with the professor's First Amendment rights (to free speech & free practice of religion) when it ordered him to call a student he perceives to be male "Miss," "ma'am" & "she/her" & then sanctioned him for failing to do so. In the US, few things are as sacrosanct & ironclad as the Constitution's dictate that the rights & freedoms established in the First Amendment cannot ever be interfered with or limited by any government body except in very rare circumstances determined by the US Supreme Court.

But the points I made in the last paragraph, too, are just conjectures. I won't know for sure what this case is really about until I locate & read the lawsuit itself, as opposed to just press reports.

But why should one belief system (Christianity) be less important than another belief system (the idea that you can change sex)?

Why shouldn't the transgender student leave their own belief system at the classroom door?