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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Ffs lib dems

186 replies

QuentinWinters · 12/11/2018 18:36

Just opened my inbox to this little gem from the lib dems. I'm going to resign my membership I think.

Ffs lib dems
OP posts:
OnTheDarkSideOfTheSpoon · 13/11/2018 18:25

Then why are they called trans women?

Needmoresleep · 13/11/2018 18:24

Orangesnake, I am assuming this means that the Lib Dem’s support self-ID for anyone who comes under the Stonewall trans-umbrella. And that where there is potentially conflict, for example the rights of women prisoners, or child protection principles, trans trumps all.

There is conflict. Even on an individual level I don’t want to have to share changing rooms with naked people with penises. I don’t want my mother with dementia to have to share a hospital ward or a care home room with someone she would consider a man. Prisons, women’s refuges, Girl Guides, Muslim students etc.

For most things I really don’t care. The person in the cafe last week may have been male or female or trans...honestly I have no idea even though I was trying to work it out. But the coffee was good and the sandwich was fine, so I will go back.

No doubt the LibDems with their fine carefully considered policies don’t consider my concerns as legitimate, and see them as on par with being racist, so plan to dismiss them altogether. However the reality of politics is that if a party dismisses my concerns I don’t vote for them. And there are more people like me, than those who are attracted by TWAW purism. (And the Labour Party is competing for that voter demographic as well.)

I live in a constituency which the LibDems see as one they could win from Labour. At the last election I explained to a charming elderly man that I was concerned about the aggressive/misogynistic tone used on the LibDem LGBT+++ twitter feed. He was unaware and promised to check. I won’t vote LibDems next time out. And perhaps the lovely canvasser will stay at home. LibDems will have the purist party they want, but they need to recognise that this will come at the expense of voter support.

OrangeSnake · 13/11/2018 18:23

Transwomen are men who identify as women.

Wrong, Trans Women are Women, and Trans Women are Adult Human Females.

Iggi999 · 13/11/2018 18:22

That can’t be true Budgie? That’s disgusting.

LemonJello · 13/11/2018 18:21

their ability to compete in womens sport is based on hormone levels or whatever it is.

So you have no idea, but also feel able to state;

Your objections are unfounded.

😂

OrangeSnake · 13/11/2018 18:21

Let me see if I understand: a woman is "transphobic" for being alarmed at the notion that self I'd will allow any man into women's and girls' spaces etc

Well VickyEadie Self-ID won't allow "any man" into womens/girls spaces. Thats just simply now how it works. Firstly, there is nothing currently stopping abusive/violent men from just walking into a womens toilet, and some do and that is an issue with male violence that we need to tackle and face as a society.

But the idea that there is a single abusive man who is not carrying out their abuse because they don't want to break into a womens space, and instead want to go through the process of legally changing their gender (which while self-ID will make it easier, it would still require them changing their legal gender and likely not being able to change it back easily, if at all), is just absurd and delusional. It just fundamentally misunderstands how abusive men behave.

VickyEadie · 13/11/2018 18:20

Ah yes, New Libdem member who posted photo of self in front of a loft ladder...

Budgieinaberet · 13/11/2018 18:19

The LDs welcome Aimee.
Aimee who has posted a picture of themselves, on a loft ladder, with a picture of a GG

I think you will find it's the LDs who should fuck off

Iggi999 · 13/11/2018 18:18

I find it hard to give too much of a fuck about this when none of us were going to vote libdem anyway.

DamnCommandments · 13/11/2018 18:17

I didn't get that one, and I get double of most things...

Nofedora · 13/11/2018 18:15

Both I and my partner left the Lib Dems over the ex-Green joining. We are not over keen being in a party that welcomes those who employ child rapists as their election agents. The Lib Dems are a shadow of what they were.

NotTerfNorCis · 13/11/2018 18:13

There fundamentally is no conflict between trans rights and other peoples rights.

There is sometimes a conflict between men's and women's interests, sport being one. Transwomen are men who identify as women. We shouldn't lose sight of that. Reality matters.

OrangeSnake · 13/11/2018 18:13

And what about the trans people who say that the lib dem policy isn't helpful, and puts their current rights - to health care for example - at risk?

They are free to disagree RedToothBrush, but our policy was written with the influence of our own trans members, and passed by the membership at our conference. Its a democratic process, and the existence of some trans people who disagree with that policy isn't really relevant? Why should their view trump the view of our trans members (who are larger in number) and of the democratic decision of conference?

VickyEadie · 13/11/2018 18:13

Somebody at a proper laptop post up some of the already available examples of how men are invading - and thereby destroying - women's sports for our uninformed friend, will you?

howlsmovingcastle84 · 13/11/2018 18:11

cheddar
Maybe the lib Dems are the official sponsor of the ducking under the bar event?

Trinity1976 · 13/11/2018 18:10

"Hormone levels are whatever it is", you say, demonstrating you know bugger all about sport before then going on to say "your fears are unfounded". How do you know our fears are unfounded when your knowledge of trans people in sports is limited to the vague notion that it is something to do with hormone levels?

VickyEadie · 13/11/2018 18:09

Let me see if I understand: a woman is "transphobic" for being alarmed at the notion that self I'd will allow any man into women's and girls' spaces etc. and is not allowed even to raise such issues. That's the "Liberal Democrat" stance, is it?

TooExtraImmatureCheddar · 13/11/2018 18:08

Balls. (As it were.) How is an averagely sized woman meant to compete on a level playing field with an averagely sized man? That’s why we have sex segregation in sports. Trans identification or hormone levels don’t change that.

howlsmovingcastle84 · 13/11/2018 18:07

My question was -what about the rights of women to compete in single sex sports? Note the words 'single sex'. So you don't think women should have that right anymore. So that's one right we can agree has been lost.

Trinity1976 · 13/11/2018 18:07

I think it's pretty clear what OrangeSnake thinks of womens concerns given that he/she put them in quote marks.

Looking forward to them explaining how self-ID can possibly work without impacting negatively on the rights and safety of women and girls.

RedToothBrush · 13/11/2018 18:06

I think the liberal democrats would be wise to understand what liberal democracy is. Its a teeny tiny identity crisis which isn't a minor issue.

And what about the trans people who say that the lib dem policy isn't helpful, and puts their current rights - to health care for example - at risk?

Are they the wrong type of trans people with the wrong opinion on their own rights. Should they fuck off too?

Just so we have it clarified.

OrangeSnake · 13/11/2018 18:04

howlsmovingcastle84 What about it? Trans people don't stop the existence of womens only sport. Trans women are women, and their ability to compete in womens sport is based on hormone levels or whatever it is. Your objections are unfounded.

howlsmovingcastle84 · 13/11/2018 17:59

orange
What about the rights of women to compete in single sex sports?

OrangeSnake · 13/11/2018 17:58

Juells No, just transphobes should fuck off. There are countless women in the libdems who stand up and fight for trans rights.

OrangeSnake · 13/11/2018 17:56

UpstartCrow Well nobody arguing for trans rights is taking away or wants to take away womens rights or dismantle safeguarding

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