A moment of pause to venerate Janice Turner

hugo rifkind is properly smart. if he's baulking at calling a man a man then shame on him. he's got absolutely no excuse for subscribing to magical thinking

I see your point Datun. It’s like every day there’s a new person who needs an express course in the nonsense and misogyny of trans magic. It surprises me every time someone smart needs it - someone like Hugo Rifkind. I thought he’d have already thought this through but it seems not because he’s balking at calling a male a man.

I agree. Tide is turning though.

Yes, true. I feel a bit twisted up about though. I do appreciate the forum, but I hate having to lie about someone’s sex to appease their feelings, while my feelings in having to lie, or to Twist my language around someone who hates and abuses women , are somehow unimportant.

I wasn't thinking about the rules on here tbh.

I know they strangle one's expression.

But, in the last two or three weeks, I have been struck, afresh, with how unique this site is in holding the discussion at all.

It's often when new people come on (TRAs and regular people) and are shocked at women being able to say no, biology isn't transphobic and I disagree with TWAW. They can't handle it.

Which makes you realise how unusual this site is.

I find the enforced deceit and language twisting on mumsnet pretty enraging. Ditto the hypocrisy, I can say Ian Huntley is a man, but if I were to say the same about various other people, I would be deleted.
I am grateful for the FWR boards, but I do think this is shameful really.

Apart from anything else, it's a sneaky, invidious way to redefine the word woman, and man, as something social, rather than biological.

oh god how i hate having to say male on here rather than man

the mangling of language - exactly

every single damn one of us knows what an adult human male is

Exactly Datun. We all know - and I’m afraid I include MNHQ here - that male people are men. Hugo knows it. Justine knows it. We all bloody know it.

Seems to be saying it’s mean to be saying Lauren (?) Hubbard is a man although it’s ok to say they are male. Ummm.

Can I just go, on record, to say that my contempt for people who say a male is fine but a man isn't, knows no bounds. They are the same. fucking. thing.

A man is an adult male.

If you are going to disagree with reality, stop mangling the language to pretend that you aren't.

Good old Janice. We know James Kirkup really wants to challenge pusillanimous colleagues and politicos but Janice has no fucks left to give and just does it.

Thanks Errol!

As for Hugo Rifkind .... feeling backed into a corner where he’s going to be forced to acknowledge a truth he doesn’t like - result, slightly bad tempered. Seems to be saying it’s mean to be saying Lauren (?) Hubbard is a man although it’s ok to say they are male. Ummm.

Yeah, don't strain yourself there, David, ffs.

Yes he does agree with her on the mob mentality but is saying the bare minimum given his stance on freedom of speech. Or indeed any thinking person’s stance on magical thinking.

Is the killer sudoku online? I thought it was just in the weekend physical papers, not the weekday ones but IS IT ONLINE TOO?! Sorry but I too love a killer sudoku.

Yes, but for some unknown reason, it's only in the browser or mobile versions of the app not the iPad version of the app (I don't know about apps on other platforms). Also, the browser/mobile versions sometimes get newly breaking stories ahead of the 'main' app.

So I use them all for different things - the iPad app is nicest to read imo and the only one I've figured out how to get sharetokens in (that may well be me not the software)

David Aaronovitch agrees with Janice.

"Well, at the risk of my second Twitter shit-storm of the week, I'm with Janice. This article is indeed an attempt to get a mob going and, given its source, is a bad omen for the future."

twitter.com/DAaronovitch/status/1056112234789855232

Is the killer sudoku online? I thought it was just in the weekend physical papers, not the weekday ones but IS IT ONLINE TOO?! Sorry but I too love a killer sudoku.

I think I detect from her latest tweet that she's getting somewhat fed up with doing all the heavy lifting and her male colleagues doing sod all. Looking at you David Aaronovitch - former chair of Index on Censorship.

Yes, I remember Louise

Reading Janice Turner makes me actually well up. She soooo gets it.

On a separate (but connected) issue does anyone remember Louise Wener - singer with Sleeper who were big for a while in the 90’s?

I think the issue here is trans women who don’t bleed rather than men who do.

Kat plenty do. The ones who don’t clearly aren’t bothered by it (just as most trans women aren’t bothered by having penises).

Controversial opinion trigger warning.

I don't understand why trans men don't stop their periods by one of the several ingenious methods of contraception e.g. the meriva coil thing.

Yes I know it's not for everyone. But (apparently) you still keep your fertility (when you take them out) and periods tend to stop...

Surely having a period would trigger gender disphoria? So why not stop? Rather than all the men who bleed nonsense?

Then people can stop getting all hurt and we can just use women in this context.