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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Butterfly - Feedback from ITV to email complaint

360 replies

ShineyNewName5032 · 24/10/2018 13:21

As many on here have noted Butterfly is possibly one of the most controversial topics covered on ITV. I wrote to express my concerns this is the response:

Dear Sir/Madam,

Thank you for your email concerning ITV’s new drama series Butterfly.

The producers consulted with senior clinical psychologists as well as the charity Mermaids. Most importantly, they spoke to families and children about their own lived experiences. The programme does not “promote” Mermaids, although the charity is depicted in a handful of scenes across three episodes. It depicts the family being advised by a range of different professionals, and indeed being offered a range of different advice, both in this country and the United States.

We do not consider that the drama is irresponsible or could “lead to more suicides”. The drama depicts a nuanced and complex story of an unhappy child, whose feelings are increasingly distressing, and which are leading to self-harming. This reflects the lived experience of some young people who are not comfortable in their assigned gender, but we do not suggest that Maxine represents all young people in this situation. It is clear that our fictional families’ problems are complex, as Maxine’s parents both clearly wish to protect their child, but cannot agree on the best course of action, and this conflict is itself shown to be damaging to Maxine’s wellbeing.

Nevertheless, thank you for sharing your thoughts with us.

Yours sincerely,

Charlie
Viewer Services Supervisor

OP posts:
BernardBlacksWineIcelolly · 25/10/2018 09:26

Bernard, I have been reasonable all along

Shock Grin

when you believe you are being unreasonable can you warn me so I can take cover?

BernardBlacksWineIcelolly · 25/10/2018 09:25

bunch of people, many of whom have been present at a 20 week scan understand that humans can't change sex

shocker!

Feminist4 · 25/10/2018 09:25

Bernard, I have been reasonable all along. But yes, I find the anti trans stance on this board deplorable.

Mrskeats · 25/10/2018 09:24

Thanks Bernard
Oh good more born in the wrong body stuff.

BernardBlacksWineIcelolly · 25/10/2018 09:24

nice summary Feminist4

just change the word 'think' to 'understand' in the your post above and I think you've got it!

Feminist4 · 25/10/2018 09:22

Larrygrylls, the reason they hate the programme is because they don't believe in such a thing as transgender people being born in the wrong body. They claim that once born a boy you are a boy regardless. They think trans women are men taking over women's rights.

BernardBlacksWineIcelolly · 25/10/2018 09:22

So Feminst4 is trollhunting at 9:16

my hand hovered over the report button as I don't believe Mrskeats should have to put up with that

however, on balance I think people should be allowed to see what kind of poster Feminist4 is

we're supposed to be polite to each other here Feminist4, it's practically the only virtue MNHQ value in their posters

Mrskeats · 25/10/2018 09:21

To be honest feminist I don't give a monkey's what you believe.
You have little knowledge and when challenged resort to flinging insults. This is typical of Trans activists.
Totally agree River. All this pink and blue bollocks.

Kardashianlove · 25/10/2018 09:21

But you obviously think it's OK to have to get 2 doctors to sign off an abortion
Genuinely really confused. Why wouldn’t anyone think it’s ok that 2 doctors are needed for an abortion to go ahead.
I would guess most people would feel reassured that such an important thing was being taken seriously and dealt with properly.

Melamin · 25/10/2018 09:19

Puberty blockers only delay puberty when they are used for a limited time for children who have precious puberty then stopped.
If they are used to prevent puberty for a few years and then replaced with cross sex hormones they are not delaying puberty but preventing it from happening until the body’s own hormones can be substituted with artificial hormones and blocking natural hormones, and this is until the parts of the body that would produce these hormones can be removed.
Since these are the parts of the body that produce the gametes necessary to reproduce the person will be sterilised.
They need to understand this before they are caught up in the idea that they can change sex as this is how they will be for the rest of their lives and it is a long time. Since this has not been done to children until very recently there is little evidence of the long term results and consequences so they are a massive experiment.

RiverTam · 25/10/2018 09:18

how anyone could wish for the sterilisation of their child (or stepchild, in this case) I can't think.

RiverTam · 25/10/2018 09:18

larry it is completely based on Susie Green, who is a real person. It's thinly veiled propaganda for her organization.

RiverTam · 25/10/2018 09:16

Mrs K Susie Green in her TED talk speaks of taking Jackie to the doctor's because he only wanted to play with 'girls' ' toys. She pathologised her son's personality. He had a homophobic father and a mother steeped in gender stereotypes.

Feminist4 · 25/10/2018 09:16

Well mrskeats. I don’t actually believe you. I’m saying I wish my trans daughter had taken blockers. They would have helped her, because she now has to overcome more prejudice as she has developed certain male characteristics she hates.

larrygrylls · 25/10/2018 09:15

It seems strange to complain about a drama because you don’t agree with what you perceive to be the message.

It is on after the watershed, so children should not be watching. And it is a fictional drama, not a documentary.

If everything controversial were taken off air tv would be an extremely dull medium. Not sure I totally agree with the infanticide in Euripides Medea but I wouldn’t complain about were it screened after the watershed.

AspieAndProud · 25/10/2018 09:15

Hormone blockers are to delay puberty. It is about enabling youngsters to have time to make the decision and reduce the bodily changes of puberty.

They don’t ‘enable’ youngsters to have time to decide, they determine the decision. 100% of those put on puberty blockers will medically transition. The majority of those not on puberty blockers will not. Puberty blockers prevent the hormones released during puberty from correcting the dysphoria.

Aspie, why don't you start campaigning against plastic surgery instead?

I would oppose plastic surgery to ‘correct’ other ‘conditions’ such as being white, or black or Asian, which are analogous to ‘correcting’ your sex.

If you are talking about burn victims or cleft palates you are appropriating medical conditions and you keep insisting that transgenderism isn’t one.

Mrskeats · 25/10/2018 09:14

And stop trying to cloud the argument with going on about abortion. Of course people need professional help whilst they make a huge, life-altering decision.

CosmicCanary · 25/10/2018 09:14

Of course I saw it. But you obviously think it's OK to have to get 2 doctors to sign off an abortion if you are using it in your anti trans argument

Where did I say it was ok?

Highlighting it was to show you that transpeople are not treated differently by the law than any other person.

I am still not seeing the legal rights you keep telling me they dont have.

LangCleg · 25/10/2018 09:14

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

Mrskeats · 25/10/2018 09:12

I work with young people
I have a detransitioned, regretful person in my family.
That ok for you feminist?
And the fact that you don't understand what blockers do clearly show you have no clue what you are talking about.
What do you think is being blocked?

Feminist4 · 25/10/2018 09:11

Of course I saw it. But you obviously think it's OK to have to get 2 doctors to sign off an abortion if you are using it in your anti trans argument.

MrsKCastle · 25/10/2018 09:11

Can I ask a question for supporters of Butterfly, like Feminist4?

Did you agree with the way the parents were portrayed at the beginning? I was quite shocked that they were shown as being so intolerant of gender non-conforming behaviour. Max was criticized and made to feel ashamed about his likes and interests. He wasn't allowed to choose his own clothes outside the house.

I wondered why they didn't choose to show a family where the child continued to insist they were the other sex despite loving acceptance of their personality. Wouldn't that have been more convincing and got more sympathy?

CosmicCanary · 25/10/2018 09:07

Cosmic Canary I suppose you don't believe in a woman's right to choose to have an abortion, judging by your arguments

Did you miss the part of my post where I said I had an abortion Fem?

You are getting desperate now.

Feminist4 · 25/10/2018 09:06

Cosmic Canary I suppose you don't believe in a woman's right to choose to have an abortion, judging by your arguments

AspieAndProud · 25/10/2018 09:04

Mrskeats, can I ask you what specific knowledge and experience you have of transgender young people?

I’m not a doctor and I don’t have diabetes but I can answer the question why doctors treat diabetes medically.

Why don’t you answer the question. Why treat a condition medically if it is not a medical problem?