Given that nearly every university student seems to believe TWAW, will sanity ever prevail?

Student politics has always been a bed of immature, introspective nonsense, where people practised politicking. Unfortunately, social media and the current breakdown of trust in mainstream parties has allowed this to assume a much greater credence than it deserves.
Mature students who seem unable to disengage and then become perpetual students seem to be the worst offenders for not living in the real world.
I think the current trans mania will pass, not everyone buys into it by a very long way, it has become as institutionalised as it has because the majority of people simply haven't noticed yet the shifts in language and policies. Only when it begins to negatively affect people will the language become more nuanced.
On the other hand, if this movement does allow a more appropriate discussion and acceptance of non conformity, that would be welcome.
I think those for whom being seen to be different as a means of attracting attention will find something else to latch onto.

The Edinburgh article was a hoot. I feel slightly sorry for the author, who says she is a butch lesbian, being stuck with a name like Daisy, possibly the least butch name in the dictionary of names.

I think some young people go along with this crap because it's easier than arguing about it. It's a fad that will die. And as someone who also has contact with teenagers, I agree that the ones who claim to be "gender non-conforming" or who prefer to be called "ze" do tend to be the ones, sadly, that are troubled in some way - obviously socially awkward or with mental health problems.

Very cheering comments on that article, I also like WERMs
I think bat-shit bull-shit will always be eventually recognised as such, as long as we're still allowed to call it what it is.

I can't say it - I'm Scottish. Wehhhr-uums.

I like WERMs

Try asking the feminist groups at uni though. From what I have seen they are all on board with it

Wait until they start work and realise having a vagina and breasts means they're second class and that someone with a penis will always be considered better.

Did you see one of the Edinburgh students used the acronym WERMS (Women Excluding Radical Misogynists) ?

I also wonder if good old sex will save the day. Most people are heterosexual and will want to mate and have children with someone of the opposite sex. Then those who are gay and bi will also find their preference partner by their sex, whatever you present gender wise sex will ultimately dominate. That’s when I have compassion for trans people because I do think they struggle finding partners because by removing secondary sex characteristics they do send out a confused message to potential sex partners and then if they also have been made infertile it could generationally quickly become a genetic dead end.

I am not suggesting that trans people will not find partners but that they will struggle more than others and have obvious problems reproducing and so as this becomes understood future generations will be more cautious.

Actually the comments are really excellent. (Maybe unsurprisingly) Edinburgh students really know their stuff! Some angles I hadnt thought of and some great summaries. .

What's more worrying is how many elected politicians seem to think TWAW. And they are the ones who are making the laws now.

I thinkn the 'trans manifesto' may help to uderstand this:

Trans Manifesto
"In 2014, a group of trans organisations came together to produce a "Trans Manifesto" - a document asking political parties to commit to better equality for trans people. We are pleased that these "asks of political parties" were already items under discussion as part of the latest equalities paper, and were debated, voted on and passed as policy of the entire Liberal Democrat party in Autumn 2014." (continues)

lgbt.libdems.org.uk/en/page/trans-manifesto

I can confidently say that pretty much nobody (possibly absolutely nobody, cause I haven‘t met anyone yet who does) in STEM believes that TWAW, let alone that women can have penises or mammals can change sex.
Nobody there has patience for this Pomo crap. There is a reason STEM students are known as particularly bright.

Loving the Edinburgh students - the comments are priceless!

When I was a student I had almost no feminist consciousness at all and I came through fun woke feminism to get to where I am today (very radical leaning and much better read on feminist discourse, though I still have a really long way to go). Women mature. I fully expect that I shall continue to mature and read and learn.

You shouldn't judge the future of society by what a load of 20 year olds are saying.

Of course many boys will go through their whole lives not giving a shit about women's liberation because that is a luxury they have, while we still live in a patriarchal society the next generation of feminists will always emerge.

Young people are often idealistic and will latch on to something like this because it's painted as a 'progressive' cause. They'll probably be like any other generation of university students though, half of them will probably be Tories in a few years time.

I also find it interesting that there are a number of people who are “professionals” in this line of work who remain in the bubble. For example the trans man who was on Queer Eye on the episode on the second series “Skye’s the Limit” to celebrate a party for Skylar’s top surgery. After transitioning at Uni and becoming estranged from their family, Skylar had stayed within the academic setting in some kind of position I believe helping LGBTQ students. It was also interesting to me that the Fab Five were really trying to transition Skylar to an adult male image which Skylar seemed to find quite threatening because Skylar seemed very young and immature in Skylar’s mode of dress. The boys were trying to ditch a lot of the rainbow flag motives for example.

I guess what I am trying to say is that to maintain a certain amount of delusion and to cope many individuals seem to stay in a cultural bubble.

I felt for Skylar as being in the US the medical bills were enormous and not covered by insurance.

I have teenagers and we have GC conversations because they are not at Uni yet and forewarned is forearmed.

The only people who do yell that TWAW in the institution I work with are a tiny number of libfems in the femsoc, which is pitifully small, sadly. A couple of people from the LGBTsoc, also remarkably small. and about 5 academics.

I would say that it's more public sector that we need to concentrate on. Especially social work and related fields. They seem to have been leaned on hardest by the TRA propaganda machine. However, I think once the witch hunts have calmed down, they will also give their heads a wobble.

They don't! My 14 year old said to me that it is just said as a way to bully and silence people. And he's a typical 14 year old (head in the clouds half of the time)

When I was at uni the Christian Union was throwing their weight around and picking a fight with whoever they could. i can't even remember why now, which tells you a lot about this debate too. I think it might have been to do with them refusing to say homosexuality wasn't a sin but it could well have been about something else.

It was in the student newspaper a lot and one or two friends were caught up in the aggression of it but after feeling a bit naive about what was actually happening, I realised it was all centred on a tiny fringe of people looking for a fight. Most students were completely caught up in their own lives and problems. It's (slightly) similar with this debate although this is a larger debate Most science students, in particular, will be rolling their eyes and not paying it any attention to trans issue at all.

I sometimes go down a rabbit warren of clicking on various trans accounts on FB. One particular time I found a photo of a university Christmas party - it was the LGBT society I think but they were clearly mostly trans. It was about 15 students at most and I'm going to be very blunt and rude and say the photo screamed 'misfits.' They were kids who would have been bullied at school for being socially awkward. Half looked like they needed a good wash and none passed as the opposite sex, I'm sorry to say (I felt sorry for them. Most people would). I wouldn't have shared that photo anywhere what with that being unkind but I think if you could have seen it you'd realise how unthreatening and lacking in influence these young adults are. Yes there are some very powerful aggressive MRA's doing a lot of damage right now but no most of those students' peers would not be swayed by them opinions. They'd pity them too, if anything. A lot of people are making a lot of noise and most will bitterly regret it in time and move onto other things. I feel for them in that regard

The young women doing STEM subjects are likely to be all too aware of good old fashioned sexism (thanks, Prof Strumia!) so will understand 2nd wave feminism is still needed.

You don't hear from them because they've got better things to do than student politicking and pontificating like, er, actually studying seriously hard stuff.

My DC have been bemused by their mum coming out as a radfem. (I doubt I am actually - but there you go.) Mine too ! One argued hotly about the subject until she saw her gay flatmate ‘managed out’ ( some nasty stuff) of the uni LGBT Society leadership for not toeing the new party line and daring to express mildly GC views and the other rolled her eyes about what she called her ‘situational rebel’ friends, who are now busy working their socks off in their grad jobs.

My son was complaining about Generation Pronoun just this evening. He’s a fresher and thinks it’s all stupid.

I suggested he was best if thinking of it as like a religion, you can be polite to those that believe in it whilst refusing to partake.

He doesn’t believe in God, and he certainly doesn’t believe that one’s reproductive sex can be determined by personal choice.

from frothing

They don’t
They banter abou5 it but the6 really really don’t think that a guy can turn into,a lady
So stuff the Wokies post on twitter is just like a wee thingie like I seen an alien last night
No u never u was drunk as usual

Maybe someone here can remember the details better... but in the US, at one of the "seven sister women only" colleges, there was one handmaiden activist in particular who was credited with being largely responsible for her school to admit trans women. I used to see pictures of her on social media constantly, shouting with a bullhorn and holding signs.

A couple years later, all of a sudden, she went frothing at the mouth as was usual for her, to not saying a word, literally overnight. (I personally suspect a trans woman raped her), and then a few months after that she pubically admited she changed her mind, that she no longer believed that TWAW.

I've also had seriously vocal handmaidens confide to me privately that they do not believe that TWAW. (These convos would take place AFTER I'd gained their trust and mis-represented myself as a timid and confused old lady.) I'd ask them why then were they were so energetic about hating "T" -- and their reply? Well gosh they wanted to be kind.

Most of these idiots are going to be extremely embarrassed when they lose their abortion rights in the next year or two, and the transwoman scream at them to stop complaining about biological reproductive functions because the subject is triggering to TW.