“Transwomen should be treated on female wards”

Great idea. When women like Jonathan Yaniv are housed there as patients, they can making great contributions by teaching girls how to introduce tampons and stuff. I am pretty sure Jonathan would happily take over menstruative care for women and girls for the whole ward.

Someone I know recently recounted an experience at an NHS meeting about information being written for maternity services leaflets etc

She raised the fact that all of the language was aimed at women and mothers, and did they run the risk of complaints because it assumed that anyone having a baby was female?

Most people in the room were senior midwives who thought she had lost the plot. They couldn’t understand what she was saying and the content will be produced as planned with no gender neutrality.

Will be interesting to see what happens there.

Further upthread there was a poster who wrote;
"There was a poster on here only the other day who wrote about her horrifying experience on a closed psychiatric ward where she woke in the middle of the night to find a transwoman wanking (penis involved for the avoidance of doubt) right in front of her face."
I have tried to search for the actual post but failed. Does anyone have a link? I recall reading it and wanted to find out the outcome.

Are you one of those who thinks the current government is left wing?

You do realise of course that most people who do not subscribe to left wing and/or feminist ideologues think this whole nonsense is totally insane?

I've known Tara for years. Not terribly bright. Failed law degree. Been round the houses for political parties, was in Labour for a while, briefly Lib Dem.
Repeats dogma, but doesn't understand enough of what she's saying to discuss it, so sees even mild questions as a personal attack. Gets upset, cries, flings verbal shit if challenged in even a small way.

ThistleAmore
My daughter is a very vulnerable adult (autistic with a severe learning disability) and I am so so afraid for her. It's really starting to haunt me now.

I am an adult woman with ASD, although I mask pretty well and am, for the most part, very high-functioning.

The last time I had a 'proper' FULL-ON MELTDOWN was when I had to go into hospital for gynae surgery (oopherectomy/salpingectomy related to endo) and lost it when a (female) HCP tried to inspect my wound in a small, four-bed room inhabited by other women.

I lost my sh*t as it was, but had there been men there, I might have taken someone's head off (and yes, I'm not proud, but it is what it is).

This is a terrible idea.

I just don't know what to say...it's intimidating enough being in hospital but this just takes it to a new level. Yet another slap in the face.

Does Olivia know most transwoman have a penis? Even those who have a GRC (and most don't)I think that's a good place to start. I'm not on Twitter.

I too am very worried about this. Especially when it comes to elderly, frail women, and those with mental health problems.

And myself: I have had the luck to only having been hospitalised a few times. I have never felt so vulnerable

It's just really unthinkable that someone who is supposed to be an advocate for patients would have no insight into what being a patient feels like. No concern for safety, privacy and dignity. How bloody depressing

Not in the press release, but if you look in the main report you find out some quite interesting things:

Where we could determine the sex of the person who carried out the sexual incident, they were male in 495 reports and female in 153 reports. In 328 of the reports, the sex of the person affected was not recorded. In the reports where sex was reported, females were more likely to be the person affected: 267 reports versus 229 reports where a male was the person affected. In the remainder of the reports both males and females were affected. In more than a quarter of the reports, more than one person was affected by the sexual behaviour. For the females who were affected, 66% of the people who carried out sexual incidents were male, 16% female and in 18% the sex was not known. For the males who were affected, 61% of people who carried out sexual incidents were male, 17% female and in 21% the sex was unknown.

It's funny how there are a lot of "unknown" sex of the offenders... Was it just not recorded, or what?

As for where the incidents happened:

Most of the alleged incidents took place in communal areas (416 incidents), with a smaller proportion of incidents taking place in patients’ rooms or other private areas such as toilets and bathrooms (194 incidents), in outside areas of the ward such as gardens and courtyards (70 incidents), or in areas where staff may be present (23 incidents). A small number of alleged incidents happened when patients were on escorted or unescorted leave. In the remainder of the reports, we could not determine where the incident took place.

And regarding whether the wards were mixed sex or not:

For the great majority of the reports we could not determine with any certainty whether the ward admitted both men and women (mixed-sex) or was single-sex. Around half of the incidents took place in acute adult wards or psychiatric intensive care units, with almost a quarter reported from forensic units and smaller proportions reported from learning disability units, older people’s mental health units, and child and adolescent units.

Those recommendations are extremely airy fairy with a whole lot of jargon and no real substance.

No mention of the sex of patients assaulted and the sex of patients doing the assaulting anywhere.

'assess patient risk' - do not stick someone with a penis in a room with a woman

'promote strategies to support sexual safety' - do not stick someone with a penis in a room with a woman

'respond appropriately to incidents' - ooh I know this one! It's immediately discharge the female assault victim while muttering darkly about her transphobia (what IS the non transphobic response to being sexually assaulted)

'ensure the layout promotes safety and identify high risk locations and situations' - that'll be the guy with the penis in a bed a few feet away from a woman then?

This report by the CQC on sexual safety in mental health wards is worth taking a look at. Find it very difficult to see how creating mixed-sex wards with self-ID will help the situation:

The review was initiated following concerns from CQC inspectors about sexual safety on mental health wards. Those admitted to a mental health ward may include people vulnerable to sexual abuse and people who may lack the mental capacity to make informed decisions about sexual relationships. This, combined with a high number of detained patients on many mental health wards - some in old and unsuitable buildings - staff shortages and few staff trained in how to promote sexual safety, can put patients and staff at risk of harm.

The analysis of nearly 60,000 reports made between April and June 2017 found 1,120 sexual incidents involving patients, staff, visitors and others described in 919 reports – some of which included multiple incidents. More than a third of the incidents (457) could be categorised as sexual assault or sexual harassment of patients or staff.

In 95% of all reports the alleged incidents were carried out by a patient. In 5% of reports it is alleged that a member of staff was the person who carried out the incident. About two-thirds of the people reported to have been affected by the incident were patients. In one-third of incidents, the person affected was a staff member - despite the system being a reporting and learning system specifically for incidents that affect patients.

Here are a couple of the recommendations:

-Providers should work actively to uphold the sexual wellbeing of people who use services by promoting access to information and support for patients, their families and carers. These should take into account the culture and diversity of people who use services.
-Staff working on mental health wards should have access to learning and development opportunities, including trauma- informed care principles, so they can better assess patient risk (both of those carrying out and experiencing incidents), and promote strategies to support sexual safety and to respond appropriately to sexual safety incidents.
-Providers must ensure that the physical environment of mental health wards promotes the sexual safety of patients in terms of layout and use and identify high-risk areas and locations.
-Providers should work collaboratively with stakeholders, including patients, the police and safeguarding teams, to ensure that sexual safety incidents are taken seriously and addressed appropriately. This should draw on the principles that underpin existing examples of successful collaboration, including police liaison models.

www.cqc.org.uk/news/releases/cqc-calls-new-national-guidance-improve-sexual-safety-mental-health-wards

"Wtf! Just watched the youtube video pombear
These are the people who are women? They don't even try to hide it. Sheila Jeffries is 100% correct on the AGP.

Surely that video needs to be highlighted?"

Yup.

It always mildly amuses me that there were no questions at the end of Tara's little lecture - I'm imagining most people there in a stunned silence at what they'd just been told.

However, on a serious note, this is also the sort of stuff our children are now being told in schools on so-called "diversity/lgbt days."

Weren't Karen White's ( sexual assaults at New Hall prison) rapes plural committed against a woman patient in psychiatric hospital unit with him.??

Last time I was on a ward I was knickerless in a flappy open at the back gown for days after my operation, the staff kept insisting i left curtains open too .

NO GRC and serial rapist so am saying "him " law is on my side. Come at me :-)

.

Wtf! Just watched the youtube video pombear

These are the people who are women? They don't even try to hide it. Sheila Jeffries is 100% correct on the AGP.

Surely that video needs to be highlighted?

Jess is the one who likes wnaking their cock at bus stops right? Amongst other things.

I suspect their ideology and aims would outweigh any fears about female relatives + do you really think any female relatives would tell Jess they'd just get accused of transphobia, over-reacting, maybe they were imagining it, etc etc and a lecture on how poeple commit crimes, sex is an illusion and so on and so forth.

FFS 4 women in prison got assaulted by a rapist of the penis variety (there's no other sort in teh UK) and some pro trans poeple were saying well then violence in prison is an issue, transwomen are oppressed and are women so they should defintiely continue to put teh karen whites in with the women and just assess risk a bit better.

Overlooking the fact that dicky poeple commit 97% or whatever it is of sex crime, cross dressing as a paraphilia is common in sex offenders, men are generally bigger stronger louder and more aggressive than women, possibility of pregnancy and so on and so forth.

I wonder how Jess Bradley et al would feel if their mother or sister was assaulted on a ward by a TW. But of course that's a risk worth taking because there are laws to deal with it.

Another relevant previous post from R0wantrees

There are a great number of key policies and legislation relating to trans health available from GenderGP (Dr Helen Webberley) website:

gendergp.co.uk/important-documents/

For those interested in exploring further the role that Jess Bradley and Action for Trans Health have played, this would be a useful source.

Jess Bradley (JB) is a non-binary transwoman and NUS Trans Officer. JB was one of the co-founders of TELI, and started the pressure group Action for Trans Health (ATH). ATH has some quite strange policies including the abolition of prisons... JB was listened to by the government. JB allegedly kept a blog wherein they documented taking their penis out in public spaces, allegedly including their desk at work. They are under investigation by the NUS.

THE BRITISH MEDICAL JOURNAL has apparently taken advice from Action for Trans Health:
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3331391-BMJ-Trans-health-needs-more-and-better-services

You can read more on the Jess Bradley thread:
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3325623-Jess-Bradley-a-government-advisor-on-womens-rights-suspended-by-NUS-over-indecent-blog-Part-iii

All information below direct reproductions of some posts relevant to the NHS by the indefatigable R0wantrees taken from the JB part 3 thread:

ATH was the first one to get any real traction (presumably thanks to the NUS connection)

I have been wondering about Jess Bradley's assertion of 'expert witness' status:

'Jess Bradley, Member, Executive Committee, Action for Trans Health'

witness comment:
"Jess Bradley: My name is Jess Bradley. I am a qualified health impact assessor and I am on the executive committee of an organisation called Action for Trans Health, which is the largest UK‑based democratic campaign for trans healthcare"

What might the qualification for 'health impact assessor' be?
(This is from September 2015)

Also what might have been the structure of ATH at this point- the claims made both for JB's position and the organisation seem rather grandiose?

data.parliament.uk/writtenevidence/committeeevidence.svc/evidencedocument/women-and-equalities-committee/transgender-equality/oral/21345.html

'NHS England and NHS Scotland Analysis of public consultation on
proposed service specifications for specialised Gender Identity Services for Adults'
(published earlier this year)

See Executive summary for weight given to input from both NUS and Action for Trans Health (both Jess Bradley?)
(extract)
"Current, former or prospective user of gender identity services:
There was significant similarity between the themes that were raised by respondents in this group and by organisations representing the interests of trans and non-binary people."

www.engage.england.nhs.uk/survey/gender-identity-services-for-adults/user_uploads/report-independent-analysis-consultation-responses-gender-identity-service-specifications.pdf

"See TELI Co-founder Tara Hewitt's report for UHSM which records data on 'gender' and 'trans' as 'protected characteristics':"

Gender and trans are NOT protected characteristics under the EA2010. Gender reassignment is. As is sex.

It seems inconceivable that Tara Hewitt was not aware of the 9 protected characteristics of the 2010 Equalities Act.

Tara Hewitt : Liverpool University Law 2005 – 2011
CV remote.com/tarahewitt

'UHSM employee recognised in national awards'
"Tara Hewitt, the new Equality, Diversity and Inclusion Lead at the University Hospital of South Manchester NHS Foundation Trust (UHSM), has been shortlisted for the National Excellence in Diversity Awards.

Out of thousands of nominees, Tara has been shortlisted in the Diversity Champion within the Public Sector Category for her work as a NHS Equality & Diversity Lead, Freelance Diversity Consultant working across NHS organisations in the UK.

Tara has been recognised for her role in organising the largest ever NHS-led Trans Equality Conferences in Stockport and Wigan, for conducting training sessions on Trans Equality for over 350 NHS employees across Greater Manchester and for her work tackling hate-related violence and aggression in the work place.

Tara joined UHSM in March as the Equality, Diversity and Inclusion Lead – a new role within the hospital, working to support services to utilise inclusion and to improve overall quality of care and performance."
www.uhsm.nhs.uk/news/uhsm-employee-recognised-in-national-awards/

You may be interested to read the UHSM policy with regards single sex wards:

see:
4.1
5.4.3

www.uhsm.nhs.uk/content/uploads/2015/12/2.8.2-Privacy-and-Dignity-Policy-V3.pdf

UHSM
4.1 Same Sex Accommodation
For hospital accommodation to be deemed “same sex”, it must provide sleeping areas and
toilet and washing facilities that are for men and women only. This means patients could
be:-
 In a same sex ward, where the whole ward is either men or women only
 In a single room or
 In a mixed ward, where men and women are in separate bays or rooms
 Toilet and washing facilities are for either men or women
(DoH guidance- Eliminating Mixed Sex Accommodation, 2010)

4.2 Trans is an umbrella term used to define a range of different gender variant identities.
However in respect of this policy the term is used to describe any person who intends to or has permanently transitioned to a different gender from their birth gender.

5.4.3 Transsexual Patients
Trans patients enjoy legal protection against discrimination. In addition good practice requires clinical responses be patient-centred, respectful and flexible towards all transgender people who do not meet these criteria but who live continuously or temporarily in the gender role that is opposite to their natal sex. They must be accommodated according to their presentation - the way they dress and the name and pronouns that they
currently use (please refer to 4.2).
5.4.3 (i) Those who have undergone full-time transition should always be accommodated according to their gender presentation. Different genital or breast sex appearance is not a bar to this, since sufficient privacy can usually be ensured through the use of curtains or by accommodation in a single side room adjacent to a sex-appropriate ward. This approach may only be varied under special circumstances where, for instance, the treatment is sexspecific
and necessitates a Trans person being placed in an otherwise opposite sex ward.
Such departures should be proportionate to achieving a ‘legitimate aim’, for instance, a safe nursing environment. This may arise, for instance, when a Trans man is having a hysterectomy in a hospital, or hospital ward that is designated specifically for women, and
no side room is available. The situation should be discussed with the individual concerned and a joint decision made as to how to resolve it.
At all times this should be done according to the wishes of the patient, rather than the convenience of the staff.
5.4.3 (ii) In addition to these safeguards, where admission/triage staff are unsure of a person’s gender, they should, where possible, ask discreetly where the person would be most comfortably accommodated. They should then comply with the patient’s preference immediately, or as soon as practicable. If patients are transferred to a ward, this should also be in accordance with their continuous gender presentation (unless the patient requests
otherwise).

5.4.3.(vi) Gender variant children and young people should be accorded the same respect for their self-defined gender as are Trans adults, regardless of their genital sex. There is no segregation, as is often the case with children, there may be no requirement to treat a young gender variant person any differently from other children and young people. Where segregation is deemed necessary, then it should be in accordance with the dress, preferred name and/or stated gender identity of the child or young person. In some instances, parents or those with parental responsibility may have a view that is not consistent with the child’s view. If possible, the child’s preference should prevail even if the child is not Gillick
competent.

5.4.3.(vii) More in-depth discussion and greater sensitivity may need to be extended to adolescents whose secondary sex characteristics have developed and whose view of their gender identity may have consolidated in contradiction to their sex appearance. It should be borne in mind that they are extremely likely to continue to experience a gender identity that is inconsistent with their natal sex appearance, so their current gender identity should be fully supported in terms of their accommodation and use of toilet and bathing facilities. It should also be noted that, although rare, children may have conditions where genital appearance is not clearly male or female and therefore personal privacy may be a priority

NB this is from UHSM website V 3 November 2014, states Next review date March 2018 so may be modified.

Jess Bradley/Action for Trans Health has been at the heart of the Trans Rights activism and lobbying groups. Jess Bradley seems to have a great deal of influence and power and this has been accorded to her by individuals and groups representing government and parliament, charities, statutory services and organisations including those concerned with safeguarding vulnerable adults & child protection and legislative policy and frameworks.

'NHS England and NHS Scotland Analysis of public consultation on
proposed service specifications for specialised Gender Identity Services for Adults' (published earlier this year)

Along with NUS, Action for Trans Health & GIRES, an organisation called UK Trans Info is referenced quite a lot.

On its website it says:
"UK Trans Info is a national charity focused on improving the lives of trans and non-binary people in the UK.

Our main aims are to:

Bring together resources from around the UK making them easily accessible to all through one website.
Endeavour to add new resources as they become available and to publicise them through social media.
Recognise and attempt to close gaps in the resources that are currently available.
Give trans and non-binary people in the UK a voice by campaigning for our rights.
Work with and educate individuals and organisations to ensure the needs of trans and non-binary people are taken into account.
Promote transparency, clarity and openness within public sector organisations.
Signpost those in need to the resources they require and in some cases contacting organisations or individuals on their behalf.
Promote action and awareness of relevant surveys, conventions, consultations and research projects.
Engage and collaborate with other trans and non-binary organisations to pool resources, strengthen our collective voice and reduce duplication of work."

Not sure if this is a charity or not, there is a FB group as well but not much info about its structure etc

tiac.lgbt/

Sorry. I didn’t meant to make it about me but I just wanted to show that men shouldn’t be in spaces with vulnerable women for any longer than they need to be (although totally understand the way women are abandoned without care and left to rely on parents).

Thank you for your kind words.

For those advocating small steps to help Olivia BUtterworth along the right path, you may want to look at the rest of her Twitter feed.

Re Karen Wood's violent offending history against woemn and children:

(extract)
"Briscoe, who also knew Wood and had access to his record, said there was “no sign at all that he was trans”, describing him as a “very manipulative” person who would “develop relationships with vulnerable residents in the hostel and befriend them”. He repeatedly breached his probation conditions, she said, and was not recalled to prison after the rape.

Briscoe, now a senior therapist at a charity, said Wood had a history of seeking access to mixed and women’s institutions to find and abuse vulnerable people. As well as the bail hostel and the prison, she said, police told her Wood had gained admission to a mixed psychiatric ward, where he had repeatedly raped a young woman patient suffering from Asperger’s syndrome.

www.thetimes.co.uk/article/why-was-convicted-paedophile-allowed-to-move-to-a-female-jail-nmpbfm272

There is recognition of the importance of same sex wards but wouldn't Karen White, formerly known as David Thompson and Stephen Wood be placed on female ward?