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Original poster

Talked with trans-ally dd this evening.

81 replies

JellySlice · 26/09/2018 23:59

Dd is 15, and knows that we have opposite opinions on trans issues. She saw my FPFW pack (which I had deliberately left open on the kitchen table) and asked me about it.

She listened carefully to what I had to say, asked questions, tried to present her viewpoint. I lost her when I explained that I don't think that I should have to lie because someone else wants to be different.

But during the conversation dd cried. Not sobbing, just a red face and wet eyes. And my heart broke for her. The rational part of her keeps getting glimpses of the Emperor's bare skin, but the female-socialised, compassionate, SM-influenced teenager can't cope with the contradictions. She has autistic traits, and once she believes something finds it very difficult to change her belief. Plus she's GNC and sees that as something she has in common with transpeople, rather than having her femaleness in common with women.

And my heart broke for her. She's trying to be a good, kind person. She's swallowed all the "you can be anything you want" and the "we should be inclusive of people who are different ", and now we telling her that that's wrong. And she cannot conceive of a world where she has no rights, and has no idea of what she stands to lose.

Sad
OP posts:
LassWiADelicateAir · 27/09/2018 00:38

Can you conceive of that now? Because that's where we'll be heading back to if women's right are erased

No that is not where we are heading. You are doing her no favours.

CircumzenithalArc · 27/09/2018 00:29

She's 15. They grow out of it. Stay strong.

Original poster
JellySlice · 27/09/2018 00:25

No, Lass, she doesn't - right now.

But when I was her age it was legal for a husband to rape his wife. A married woman had no right say "No" to her husband.

When I was her age "She was wearing a miniskirt so she was asking for it. She was leading me on." was an acceptable defence against a charge of rape.

When my mother was her age she had to get my father's permission to get a job.

When my grandmother was her age she had a secret and illegal abortion that nearly killed her.

My other grandmother had no more children because of birth injuries that she was too embarrassed to talk to the doctor about. So she suffered for the rest of her life.

Can you conceive of that now? Because that's where we'll be heading back to if women's right are erased.

OP posts:
MsJeminaPuddleduck · 27/09/2018 00:23

But we should be inclusive of people who are different - of course - that has always been true and remains so. Treating people trans or (anyone different) with dignity, respect and ensuring that they have equal access to opportunities and services does not need to and absolutely should not come at the expense of women (and children's - as it is generally the women that safeguard) hard won rights. It is a false dichotomy set up by the trans lobby which helps no one - least of all those with actual gender dsyphoria

The need for dignity/ respect etc is not at issue - it's the 'how' it is best provided for (and there are other alternatives that could be considered such as 'third' spaces etc)

arranfan · 27/09/2018 00:07

Has your DD read Jane Clare Jones' posts? It's hard but the issue of trans is a stage on the way to the progress of totalitarianism. The most recent one is shocking but her earlier ones are spot on about why these issues are not to be compared with the struggle for gay rights etc. of previous years.

For those of you out there still sitting on the fence, or who still believe that I, and everyone opposing this ‘civil rights movement’, is just a nasty evil hate-mongering bigot, please, if you give one shit about women and the protection of women, wake-the-fuck-up. This is actually happening, it’s scary as shit, and we may well be running out of time. This is what woman-hating totalitarianism looks like. This is not a fucking drill.

janeclarejones.com/2018/09/26/twitter-trans-rights-totalitarianism-and-the-erasure-of-sex/amp/?__twitter_impression=true

LassWiADelicateAir · 27/09/2018 00:02

She doesn't live in a world where she has no rights.

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