India Willoughby meltdown on Twitter re Pips Bunce

India fears men like Bunce because it shows up the “identify as” bullshit for what it is. If woman is a feeling, then it follows that you need only have that feeling from tine to time, and no surgery is required. It makes people go “but if Pippa isn’t a woman, perhaps a man with his cock inverted and a surgically created wound isn’t a woman either”

Erm... You do know we're already there right?

I think it could get very much worse, I'm afraid. The situation now is bad but if you explore where things could end up.... As you say at least now a trans person's historycanbe disclosed in the pursuit of a criminal investigation.

I note that Willoughby uses male pronouns for Bunce, which I had previously understood to be a capital offence.

I can't tell you how shocked I am.

This is massively entertaining, though. Having ranted and raved about the evil fascist Mumsnetters' opposition to self-ID, India finally sees the consequences of self-ID in action and doesn't like it. So does that make India an evil fascist too? Listen to India's brain slowly ticking as she tries to work it out.

Going back to the OP I note that Willoughby uses male pronouns for Bunce, which I had previously understood to be a capital offence.

Apart from that, I find India's use of the 'free speech is hate speech' trope to be ridiculous, counterproductive and incredibly worrying in equal measure.

gendercritter:

I think this is where some people would like society to get to. That once a certain amount of surgery is done, one isn't allowed to ask about the T word or acknowledge it in any way. It's too Orwellian for my liking.

Erm... You do know we're already there right?

Once someone has a GRC, it is illegal for anyone in a professional capacity to disclose that person is transgender even to a colleague. There's even arguments right now that rape must be scubbed from criminal records if it reveals that someone was once a man.

Small mercies: Trans history can be disclosed in the pursuit of a criminal investigation.

That link to Willoughby’s twitter comes up as no longer existing.

gendercritter. That's why it's important to separate "women" from "women's biology". Because while that is allowed to continue male transpeople will never completely transition.

Thats why 'men have period, need terminations..." is the only transmens right anyone talks about - it benefits males to separate women from their biology.

The broadening of the trans umbrella throws people with GD under the bus alongside some systems put in place to support them.

The broadening of the trans umbrella also highlights how the systems put in place to protect people (mainly males) with gd has thrown women under the bus.

Agree with whoever said that india's definition of women is "ME!!!!!".

I found these tweets quite chilling. I think this is where some people would like society to get to. That once a certain amount of surgery is done, one isn't allowed to ask about the T word or acknowledge it in any way. It's too Orwellian for my liking. India doesn't pass outside of photos. It's ludicrous

India hopes the proposed changes to the GRA are dropped. Perhaps someone on twitter could send her the consultation link.

Hear, hear Datun!

Oh now im scared

Bwah ha ha.

Lang, out with it; what have you had for breakfast?

Special K. The DH didn't get the one with red berries in it which is, apparently, heresy, so DS1 won't eat it. It is a function of the patriarchy that I am the house food hoover. And you wonder why I default to the WBH.

Many trans identities involve completely divorcing sex and gender, others depend on sex and gender bring conflated and certain trans people's interests conflict with other trans people's.

And here's Caitlin Jenner describing the long process it took to become a 'loose woman'

twitter.com/loosewomen/status/1042738517397397509

Sick of this. Male born people deciding exactly how and why they can usurp women.

Tara Hudson demanding it's longevity.

Debbie Hayton demanding it's surgery.

India Willoughby demanding it's gender dysphoria.

Phillip Bunce demanding it's clothes.

Stonewall demanding it doesn't matter, it's whatever they say it is, including rapists, paedophiles and nappy fetishists.

They couldn't make themselves look more ridiculous if they tried.

God knows why, but I'm feeling quite jolly this morning

Lang, out with it; what have you had for breakfast?

In the times article about Philip/pippa Bunce (which is a great article & Kristina Harrison & Kirk tunks if you're reading you are fab) the article ends 'Mr Bunce declined to comment'

So the times is clear that they think he is male.

If you remove some of the wording/constructs that IW uses, I agree with some of her sentiments......

There is a world of difference between people who suffer from gender dysphoria and everybody else who places themselves under the trans umberalla.

The broadening of the trans umbrella throws people with GD under the bus alongside some systems put in place to support them.

Many trans identities involve completely divorcing sex and gender, others depend on sex and gender bring conflated and certain trans people's interests conflict with other trans people's.

I actually think that the more society is forced to cater for the full range of trans identities, the less threat this could present to women and girls. Provision of gender neutral services alongside sex based provision would work for all but mtf and ftm trans people. I expect this is what upsets IW so much.

God knows why, but I'm feeling quite jolly this morning

Oh now im scared 😩

During the week she lived in Newcastle where she donned skirts, heels and makeup to work as glamorous female PR executive Joanne Charles.

I wonder if Joanne Charles also required female colleagues to share same sex spaces, use Joanne Charles' preferred pronouns etc and really, if Joanne had been put forward for a 'Women in PR' award at the time would Joanne/Jonathan have been so distressed by the inappropriateness of this?

I think that story was meant to make the reader feel sorry for India? Mostly made me feel sorry for India's wife.

have at it, ohthehills, I'm not on Twitter myself, and only half the quotation is my own original work

Nicely put, nice.

I find that story about India's two lives quite disconcerting.

India would like to gatekeep the bounds of womanhood at exactly that point that India gets to enter it. India and Pips only disagree about the exact placement of the boot on women's necks

Brilliant. Can we all quote this on Twitter.

Philip Bunce has a SAHM wife who facilitates his career. She's taken the hit to her career because of her biology What the fuck do these men not understand?

Plonkers.

nice

Succinctly put