Page 16 | Women on the left are responsible for austerity

CarrotyO · 2018-09-17T20:59:17+00:00

I've heard it said that women on the left actually support and are therefore in some way responsible for austerity. This is because both Labour and the Tories support austerity. Therefore any woman who supports Labour, or the Left in general, also knowingly and consciously supports austerity and are therefore also responsible for the 1000s of deaths of disabled people caused by austerity. Does anyone have any thoughts on this?

R0wantrees · 18/09/2018 12:10

If I was a cynic I might wonder if endangering that sense of solidarity was part of the reason why not only was this thread started but the one before it was almost derailed just as it became clear just how vital that thread had been in opening many women's eyes to dynamics that had previously been unclear to them.

AAK I got as far as your comment and have stopped reading!

deepwatersolo · 18/09/2018 12:10

women actively working to protect our sex based rights

Surely that right also includes not being threatened and ostracized by the Brownshirts in Drag?

BeyondAnOmnishambles · 18/09/2018 12:09

I'm talking generally and not about anyone specific, but if...

Party politics/austerity > all women
Party politics/"anti racism" > all women

Putting party politics ahead of women is not a feminist act.
I don't see how Lisa making this point about specific women is difficult to understand?

AngryAttackKittens · 18/09/2018 12:09

If Carroty wants to have an entire argument with herself and then declare herself the winner who am I to stop her?

Original poster

CarrotyO · 18/09/2018 12:08

So you do think that women involved in Wpuk are responsible for austerity

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deepwatersolo · 18/09/2018 12:07

Ok. So nobody agrees with the claims Lisa is making. Thank you

Nice copout. But wrong.

I am not nobody. That I do not agree with your spin and misrepresentations of her claims does not mean I do not agree with Lisa's claims.

Original poster

CarrotyO · 18/09/2018 12:06

And people are generally fine with unfounded smears against women actively working to protect our sex based rights being propagated but are keen to protect women propagating smears and bringing us all into disrepute with her racist rhetoric. Got it.

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Original poster

CarrotyO · 18/09/2018 12:04

Ok. So nobody agrees with the claims Lisa is making. Thank you

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BeyondAnOmnishambles · 18/09/2018 12:03

"Can I just clarify that people here agree that women acting on anti-racist principles did so to bolster party politics and are therefore responsible for the deaths of 100,000s of disabled people resulting from welfare cuts?"

If anyone is stating a causative relationship between these two very specific things, I think the welfare cuts bit came first.

AngryAttackKittens · 18/09/2018 12:01

Aside - bison are massive. Magnificent and all, but I'd rather they be magnificent at a safe distance if that's alright with everyone else.

JackyHolyoake · 18/09/2018 12:01

This may be a helpful reminder

Women on the left are responsible for austerity

deepwatersolo · 18/09/2018 12:00

Also, "welfare" - are you American?

Imagine that: All those -furry- bisons inheriting the Earth...

Dragoncake · 18/09/2018 11:59

Can I just confirm that personal attacks are OK if people disagree with you?

AngryAttackKittens · 18/09/2018 11:57

(Also I'm amused that anyone could confuse "my mama bear instincts are fully engaged" with "I am too intimidated to speak out against this truly terrifying working class woman whose activism focuses on protecting other working class women".)

AngryAttackKittens · 18/09/2018 11:55

If I was me I would say in response to the idea that GC women as a group are going to be so easily manipulated into throwing Lisa under the bus - not going to happen.

deepwatersolo · 18/09/2018 11:52

Can I just clarify that people here agree that women acting on anti-racist principles did so to bolster party politics and are therefore responsible for the deaths of 100,000s of disabled people resulting from welfare cuts?

You seem to struggle with logical reasoning skills. A hint: Correlation does not equal causation.

UnderHerEye · 18/09/2018 11:52

If I was a cynic I might wonder if endangering that sense of solidarity was part of the reason why not only was this thread started but the one before it was almost derailed just as it became clear just how vital that thread had been in opening many women's eyes to dynamics that had previously been unclear to them

Yes if I was a cynic i would say that this looks an awful lot like when Posie Parker was targeted, almost as if Lisa M was being lined up to be trashed and ostracised. But of course carrotty isn’t doing that, this is just a political discussion isn’t it.

(Under His Eye).

AngryAttackKittens · 18/09/2018 11:52

Also, "welfare" - are you American?

AngryAttackKittens · 18/09/2018 11:51

No, nobody is going to "clarify" the position that you have invented for you. And I think you know that, so I'm curious what the point of this whole exercise was.

deepwatersolo · 18/09/2018 11:50

'Do you have any evidence of this? Had Lisa provided any?'

Lisa has specifically said on here (did you miss that?), she is not interested in going there, as she does not want to derail WPUK, which she thinks is in principle a good thing. But she has no qualms about naming the particular people if need be. And they are the same people who publicly cast out Posie Parker. So maybe you ask her, if you want her to name those names.

I very specifically remember Lisa naming people in the media, though, on her you tube channel, like Owen Jones and Sarah Ditum, who prevented discourse on austerity.

Original poster

CarrotyO · 18/09/2018 11:49

Can I just clarify that people here agree that women acting on anti-racist principles did so to bolster party politics and are therefore responsible for the deaths of 100,000s of disabled people resulting from welfare cuts?

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Original poster

CarrotyO · 18/09/2018 11:43

I will not throw any woman under the bus as a target for extremist transactivists without feminist back-up from the sisterhood. Not Posie, not you Carroty, not even some poor handmaiden who believes TWAW and has made some petty misstep. No woman

Wpuk were clearly not willing to throw Muslim women under the bus! But people are happy to continuously undermine them as a result of this.

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Original poster

CarrotyO · 18/09/2018 11:41

You don’t think that smearing women running a campaign at great personal risk is affecting the solidarity of our movement?

You don’t think that posting racist tweets is affecting the solidarity of our movement?

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Original poster

CarrotyO · 18/09/2018 11:40

If the particular women in WPUK helped maintain the consensus on austerity and prevented meaningful discussion on it, as Lisa says, of course they are co-responsible for the maintainance of austerity and the consequences, including deaths

Do you have any evidence of this? Had Lisa provided any?

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AngryAttackKittens · 18/09/2018 11:38

If I was a cynic I might wonder if endangering that sense of solidarity was part of the reason why not only was this thread started but the one before it was almost derailed just as it became clear just how vital that thread had been in opening many women's eyes to dynamics that had previously been unclear to them.