Please or to access all these features

Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

New Kirkup article about Bercow's refusal to let MPs discuss Karen White

118 replies

OrchidInTheSun · 14/09/2018 12:43

As we thought, Bercow does indeed have connections with LGBT lobbying groups - he is president of the Kaleidoscope Trust

blogs.spectator.co.uk/2018/09/the-state-has-failed-karen-whites-victims/

OP posts:
SunsetBeetch · 14/09/2018 19:51

More interesting stuff on Bercow:

www.stonewall.org.uk/john-bercow

"And as @alonelybeachhut has just reminded us, Bercow also covered up for Keith Vaz and prevented the police investigation into Vaz's exploits with young male prostitutes being raised in parliament"

twitter.com/PilgrimTucker/status/1040664404315066370?s=19

"oh yes, the VAZ story is far worse than rent boys.
google his name with Nigel Philpot Jones ...that is part of some of the story"

twitter.com/alonelybeachhut/status/1040664272253145088?s=19

"The same Keith Vaz who "acted in an inappropriate and bullying way to try and stop the council from evicting a male brothel owner over missing rent payments"

twitter.com/PilgrimTucker/status/1040669091890118657?s=19

Wheels within wheels...

AnyFucker · 14/09/2018 19:50

Great article, James

AspieAndProud · 14/09/2018 19:45

"Unexpected item in the bagging area."

There's a joke in here somewhere but I don't want to get myself banned.

BayeauxT · 14/09/2018 19:39

Your letter is great partystress - I used it to cobble together an email to my Tory MP; I wrote to him earlier this year to ask his position re the GRA and while he was supportive he also said at the time that single-sex organisations would be sensible about how they applied the rules. Obviously Karen White shows that up to be rather naive - so I’ve just done an ‘I told you so’! And thrown in a few choice words about Bercow...

MrsTerryPratchett · 14/09/2018 19:12

Mr Speaker receives many applications for Urgent Questions every day but regretfully due to time constraints not all can be given debating time.

Translation: We don't actively hate you. We just don't give a shit about you.

Ereshkigal · 14/09/2018 18:39

Already had a response! They are primed and ready to stamp on our uppity asses....

I bet they are! That's like the BBC brush off of why they didn't cover the Challenor story.

Ereshkigal · 14/09/2018 18:37

Thank you so much again James. Such a regular occurrence that I say that!

partystress · 14/09/2018 18:37

Already had a response! They are primed and ready to stamp on our uppity asses....

Mr Speaker receives many applications for Urgent Questions every day but regretfully due to time constraints not all can be given debating time.

I have replied and asked for an answer as to why this particular issue was deemed not worthy of debating time, especially given that women are underrepresented in Parliament and therefore need the leadership of that institution to listen to their concerns.

IAmNotInvisible · 14/09/2018 18:32

Is it worth starting a yougov petition? The blocking of the upskirting debate galvanised lots of people and reached mainstream news. Would have thought wider publicity of Bercow's blocking questions would raise a few more eyebrows.

SophoclesTheFox · 14/09/2018 18:30

Good article, James.

And I see that it is David Davies, that unlikely but doughty champion of women's free speech, who is putting his head above the parapet again. Well played David.

Grow some fucking backbone, MPs!

ignatiusjreilly · 14/09/2018 18:30

partystress very well-written letter. Please let us know if you get a response.

ignatiusjreilly · 14/09/2018 18:27

Another excellent article from JK.

I find I can read Spectator articles via Google without having to subscribe.
www.google.co.uk/amp/s/blogs.spectator.co.uk/2018/09/the-state-has-failed-karen-whites-victims/amp/

Does that work for anyone else?

I might have to subscribe though, as they definitely deserve more readers for not being afraid to ask questions on this issue.

partystress · 14/09/2018 18:24

He's my MP. I've emailed him today to ask what his justification is and whether he doesn't think that it is suppression of highly relevant debate this close to the closure of the GRA consultation. I have had an auto reply saying he will respond within 10 working days.

Dear Mr Bercow

You are my constituency MP. Coverage of your refusal to allow the proposed UQ prompted by the Karen White case has alarmed me.

As the consultation period on changes to the GRA nears closure, stifling debate on one aspect of the impact on sex-based rights of allowing self-id, is very worrying.

I appreciate as president of an LGBT-advocacy group that you may feel in a difficult position on this. Please make yourself aware of the agenda of groups such as Fair Play for Women and A Woman's Place, and read the compelling journalism of Janice Turner to understand that there is no intention to discriminate against transgender people, but that the extension and protection of transgender rights needs to be progressed without diminishing the vital sex-based protections that women have fought hard to achieve.

Single-sex spaces are vital for women and girls for so many reasons. Many women in prisons will already have been the victims of assault and sexual violence by men. Allowing prisoners who are still intact males into women's prisons puts all women there at risk and is cruel beyond belief to those who have been victims of male violence and abuse.

Girls dealing with menstruation for the first time, or seeking refuge from the constant 'banter' on breast size and bras from their boy peers, need girls' toilets in schools.

Women and children sheltering in refuges having suffered or witnessed violence and abuse need space away from men: they do not need men, whether ill-intentioned or not, in the spaces that have been designed to help them recover from that trauma.

You will, I am sure, be aware of the multitude of strategies that have been employed by pressure groups and a small but very vocal group of academics to stifle public debate and questioning of the risks to women of allowing self-id: these include physical violence, attempts to remove women from their jobs (sometimes successfully), intimidation and no-platforming. Parliament should be above this.

I am a mother of two teenage children, one of them a daughter. I have fought for and celebrated equal rights for people regardless of race, sex or sexual orientation. I firmly believe that transgender people should be afforded the same protection from discrimination and violence as anyone else. I do not think that that translates into allowing someone who retains a penis to be classed as a woman for the purposes of entry to places that are designated as single sex spaces for women.

The Karen White case is one example of the risks to women and came about because of interpretation of right-based law by a government institution. If that is not worthy of debate in Parliament, I would like to know why.

I look forward to your response.

VickyEadie · 14/09/2018 18:22

It's just very, very hard not to conclude that he does not give the shiniest of shits about women.

And that there are many, many , many people like him in the government, the media, charities and the public sector

CrackpotsArePots · 14/09/2018 18:01

It's just very, very hard not to conclude that he does not give the shiniest of shits about women.

And that there are many, many , many people like him in the government, the media, charities and the public sector

Apollo440 · 14/09/2018 17:55

I've subscribed to the Spectator. It's the least I can do. I have also completely changed my mind about the importance of traditional print media given how virtually every other online media has been bullied into submission by TRAs. But also hat's off to Mumsnet for allowing people a voice. I think they have been instrumental in starting the debate the trans lobby wanted to avoid.

Callmejudith · 14/09/2018 17:18

James is my new hero

Theswaggyotter · 14/09/2018 16:27

Done.
I’m sick of being silenced

Theswaggyotter · 14/09/2018 16:23

Thanks olenna maybe worth a try

OlennasWimple · 14/09/2018 16:22

Theswaggy - if your FB friends register with the Spectator they can read a couple of articles free every month

OlennasWimple · 14/09/2018 16:21

Excellent article

I can't see any comments, though?

Theswaggyotter · 14/09/2018 16:18

I have subscribed to spectator now because of James Kirkup’s articles. Does anyone know if I share on fb will it be visible or still behind paywall - I’m guessing the latter.
I just feel this story is not being publicised enough and it’s a huge fucking scandal
I’m really angry about it Angry

FermatsTheorem · 14/09/2018 16:10

My weekly heartfelt "Thank you James."

Yes, I do sense that he is getting crosser and crosser, and rightly so.

"But even by the dismal standards of the trans debate, where supposedly responsible figures routinely shirk their duties to appease a small, aggressive group of activists and lobbyists, John Bercow’s decision strikes me as repulsive, a disgusting abdication of responsibility that brings shame on its author and his office."

Round of applause for that in particular.

One thing I would add to his excellent article is that both the professional body of psychologists who work in prisons and the prison governors association have warned about this - the former to Maria Miller's parliamentary select committee. Which makes the safeguarding failure even worse - because they were told at the highest levels that this would happen, by people whose expertise in the field was unsurpassed, and those with power to do something chose to ignore those very clear, unambiguous warnings.

ChattyLion · 14/09/2018 15:34

I am really shocked at the Speaker blocking this! WTF.

Theswaggyotter · 14/09/2018 15:05

Thanks James, this story needs publicity we can’t let it disappear
When I tried to talk about this on another forum (closed group of professional women on fb) I was told that transwomen are women and I was being hateful. It beggars belief that anyone could try to defend this scandalous placement

Please create an account

To comment on this thread you need to create a Mumsnet account.

This thread is closed and is no longer accepting replies. Click here to start a new thread.