5 of 6 medallists in a US men's & women's championship finals were biologically male

No they are most certainly not.

Lots of belief through history and this is what underpins many societies now, that women are like men but substandard and malfunctioning though.

There are so many physical differences between men and women, it's ridiculous to claim that we are the same but with a bit of extra testosterone.

Pelvis. Length of bones. Lung capacity. Forearm muscles. Forearm rotation and how arms hang by our sides. Fat distribution. Calorie consumption even when we are sitting doing nothing much.

Men are not women with a penis stuck on.

Rember the IOC decided that the ONLY difference bewteen men and women is testosterone levels and then set the level that a man could compete in women's sports at the lower end of normal for men (and many times above normal range for women).

Sure sports people I'm sure often have unusual readings and stuff but still this smelt like shit to me.

I thikn they may have reduced it a bit now.
But the idea that the only difference between men and women is testosterone is bonkers.
Look at teh respective top basketball teams for a start (and do it quick before all the women's team have dicks)

No I think they dont' want to put themselves in for all the abuse and threats
And they're sports people not politicians or something
I very much doubt they are keen to see women's sport go down the plughole but it's too risky to say anything
Their governing bodies woudl probably get lobbied to ban them
And championships would get approached to revoke their medals etc etc

Is there anyone in sports speaking out about this? One of our national figures like Victora Pendleton or Laura ? (you know, the one who has just had a break in her career due to giving birth!).

Sometimes I wish there was a third sex who were taller, stronger and more muscular than men, so they would understand a bit of what women experience. But then I immediately stop wishing for that because I wouldn’t want the males I love to feel that way.

There are young elite female athletes in my family. This shit will destroy their dreams.

I think the idea is that if strapping 6ft4 person wanders into teh girls changing rooms with a deep voice and a beard

You mustn't use any of those characteristics to say hold on that's a bloke
Some women are strapping
Some women are tall
Some women have deep voices
And OHO some women have PCOS

It's an attempt to make women second guess and keep quiet when they fucking well know a chap when he's right in front of them.

Has that althete got a penis because of PCOS as well?

Yes - really don't bring PC ovary S into this if you want to be taken seriously. Pcos isn't remotely related to trans or intersex. The people who try to coopt it should perhaps consider that the treatments are often things like antiandrogens, ovulation inducers - not some sort of conversion therapy but correcting an abnormality and always in the direction of preserving fertility.

FFS.

Do you think Andreya has stubble because they have PCO?

Women. The word you are looking for is women. Because you cannot have polycystic ovaries unless you have ovaries (I speak as someone who did indeed suffer from PCOS as a younger woman).

And it raises your testosterone from about 1.5nmol/litre to about 2.5. Nowhere near the 10 to 30 nmol/litre in men, which is the biological category these young athletes competing (according to their own testimony on twitter and similar social media) without any hormone blockers or cross-sex hormones (not that those actually make anywhere near as much difference as trans-allies claim they do).

Please don't bring stubble into it. You know very well that a lot of ... oops, I can't even use the word, because of MN censorship. A lot of [3 letter word censored] women with PCOS have facial hair and hence often have facial stubble if they aren't very careful.

I'm bumping this because I am so fucking angry.

Is this on AIBU?

Shocking. Frightening. What a load of old tosh.

What the actual fuck I've been fairly laid back but this is just insane . How are they allowed to compete surely scientists can argue similar advantages from doping to physical advantages. Call them whatever you like but if their biologically different of if like doping gives you an advantage it can't be equal they can't compete against each other. Like the paraolympics shouldn't it be like that

Maybe athletes whose claim to girlhood depends on pink fluffy slippers should run in them?

FFS.

I just hope the winners of the women's race are happy with everyone knowing they are not good enough to compete in the men's race. Because we all know, we all fucking know.

Oh and I never had pink furry boots, does that make me a boy. Twirl your hair all you like loser, we see you.

Apparently it's a very complex issue.

The thing that baffles me about the sort of women you describe, Materialist, is the sheer inconsistency of it.

"Pink brains and blue brains... no threat to feminism at all - oh, and by the way, that means men in women's sport is totes okay..." = progressive and liberal

vs.

"brains are just brains - they're not 'gendered', but there are physical differences between men and women..." OMG YOU BIGOT, YOU REALISE THE WHOLE EDIFICE OF FEMINISM WILL COLLAPSE IF WE ADMIT MEN CAN RUN FASTER THAN WOMEN...

Seriously, I have had a numpty say this to me on one of the past threads on transwomen in women's sport.

That's awful. What a farce of an event.

Fucking hell, I could weep for girls with sporting talent in the USA, who may formerly have been able to get a college education with their talent, and who now have to compete with boys. Like Title IX never happened.

Tell me again how this isn't the most naked misogyny?

You are CHEATS.

I read some really vile nonsense today (I won't even dignify it with a link) that equated the advantage some transgender individuals have with the advantage individuals of certain races are supposed to have.

""The cream rises to the top," Baker added. "

This made my jaw drop tbh